Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Lovely A. Warren


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. (non-admin closure) DavidLeighEllis (talk) 00:33, 17 January 2014 (UTC)

Lovely A. Warren

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Not all so notable. "First black woman mayor of Rochester." Kind of straining. Maybe in 1974 but not today, 40 years later. Spitzer clerk but just for the "summer", which sounds pretty cursory. Citations are mostly handouts and local cruft except for slight mention in Buffalo paper, down the street from Rochester. While beside the point for Afd, not sufficiently edited either. Lots of cruft, WP:POV. Would be a pretty small article without trivia and hype and WP:BOOSTER campaign notes. Just seems insufficiently notable. Note template which gives additional links "for nothing."Student7 (talk) 00:34, 10 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Keep. Elected mayor of a city of more than 200,000 people, with plenty of news coverage, is notable. Clean up the boosterish text and keep it. --Arxiloxos (talk) 01:51, 10 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Keep. She is the mayor of a major upstate city. Bring the first African-American female mayor in city history is a big deal. The upper half of the page gives insight into her political history and education before reaching this point. It's Rochester so there is going to be more local coverage than national coverage. The first citation provides a good insight into her past which is why I chose it. There is only so much editing you can do with this kind of article. There is no "hype" about this article. I talk about the election due to it's historic nature in that all the polls were wrong.--Mo2010 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 05:47, 10 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Keep per Arxiloxos X X X antiuser eh? 05:52, 10 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Keep per views expressed above by Arxiloxos & Mo2010. Finnegas (talk) 10:02, 10 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of New York-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 19:05, 10 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Politicians-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 19:05, 10 January 2014 (UTC)


 * Speedy Keep Elected mayor of a city of more than 200,000 people. Enos733 (talk) 22:10, 10 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Speedy Keep Elected mayor of a city of more than 200,000 people. Elected mayor of the third largest city in New York State. Request for deletion of this article smacks of a feeling of Damnatio memoriae on the part of the Student7 because she's a black woman who won an election. Kusovski (talk) 03:58, 13 January 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment. Please WP:AGF. I have close relatives that are African American and descendants and in-laws that are hyphenated Americans. Most of my Afds have been aimed at white guys with similar minimal qualification.
 * WP:NPOL says 'Just being an elected local official, or an unelected candidate for political office, does not guarantee notability, although such people can still be notable if they meet the primary notability criterion of "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject of the article".' "Significant" coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject" is what is clearly lacking. Cities with a million people, nor 10 million, do not have mayors that are automatically notable. Commenters have made assumptions here that are unwarranted under the WP:BIO guideline.
 * I am concerned about the steady degradation of qualifications for notability that allows people of lesser attainments to rate an article. Student7 (talk) 16:51, 13 January 2014 (UTC)
 * There is no "steady degradation of qualifications" on evidence here. WP:OUTCOMES: "Mayors of cities of at least regional prominence have usually survived AFD, although the article should say more than just "Jane Doe is the mayor of Cityville". Mayors of smaller towns, however, are generally deemed not notable just for being mayors, although they may be notable for other reasons in addition to their mayoralty (e.g. having previously held a more notable office). Note that this criterion has not generally been as restrictive as the criterion for city councillors."  The near-unanimity of opinion here speaks to the accuracy of this distillation of consensus as to mayors. Your phrase "lesser attainments" appears to be a value judgment, not an accurate summary of the substantial coverage available here.--Arxiloxos (talk) 17:19, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

As mentioned above she's the first African-American female elected mayor of a NY city, in Upstate NY, which makes it slightly more notable due to the more rural character of Upstate. There's an entire article devoted to African-American firsts. I think she's notable enough to warrant an article of some length. I don't think we need to write a enormous biography of everything she ever did in her life. 74.69.9.224 (talk) 02:29, 14 January 2014 (UTC)
 * I have an African American specialist of whom I think a lot. One of my best doctors. I suspect her attainments are above Ms. Warren's. They are not political, however. I would not write a bio on her even if she were the first African American woman (whatever) under 5 feet six inches. The qualifications for "first" become somewhat absurd as well.
 * I have lived in several areas with a overwhelming white population. We have, on a number of occasions, selected African Americans as leaders. We didn't do it self-consciously. "Gosh! Another blow for Equal Rights." But instead looked for the person with the best credentials, which they had. Rochester has an African American population of 41%. Hardly surprising that they would elect someone African American on occasion. As in most places, women outnumbered men 10:9. Not too surprising that they might elect a woman occasionally. They have been voting Democratic since 1974 and maybe before that. So nomination as the Democratic candidate is tantamount to election.
 * To become nominated in this city of 200,000, a major deal to editors of these articles, she obtained less than 9,000 votes. http://www2.monroecounty.gov/files/2013Primary%20Election%20Cert.pdf. Not what I would term a smashing mandate.
 * If the underlying threshhold for notability for a general article is "9,000 votes," there should be a lot of articles on hundreds of thousands of local politicians from around the world. Student7 (talk) 19:54, 14 January 2014 (UTC)


 * Speedy Keep She ran in a primary against an incumbent mayor that was heavily backed by the democratic party with alot of money behind him and a well established administration that originally belonged to the lieutenant governor Robert Duffy when he was mayor from 2006 to 2010 who did not want her to run and won. The incumbent mayor was also a former CEO of the local power utility which made him a millionaire. She beat a lot of money to win this election. I am not taking about this as as a african american rights thing, I am talking about this as as a person who was able to defeat a heavily established and funded administration to win. Something that rarely happens in politics. Dhe also happens to be the first women mayor which is important in that she is the first.

Also she is of note due to the fact that she is the mayor in the 3rd largest city in the state which has much importance. She could have been elected by one vote, She is still the mayor of an important city both in history in currently. Her background is important for the same reason it is for other politicians where the article goes though their past political and educational history.

ALL Rochester mayors have been well documented up until now. For evidence look at the page of Robert Duffy (politician) the original mayor of the last administration. Mike Spano of Yonkers, Stephanie Miner of Syracuse both have pages despite their cities being even smaller than Rochester. Warren is an important figure for these reasons alone in the grand scheme of things. Mo2010 (talk) 01:39, 15 January 2014 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.