Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/M'Ress (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was merge to List of Star Trek characters (G–M). Compromise between keep and delete. (non-admin closure)  J 947 (c)  01:02, 11 May 2017 (UTC)

M'Ress
AfDs for this article: 
 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

I'd usually prod this, but since this is Star Trek, and would get deprodded for 99%, let's take this here. This is a character from the lowest-notability of Star Trek TV works, the animated series. The coverage seems to fail Notability (fiction). I am unable to find any work discussing her significance; there are few short biographies in Star Trek compendiums or fanpages but that's in-universe stuff. Not everything in Trek verse is notable, we habitually merge stuff like races into List of Star Trek races or List_of_Star_Trek_characters; not to look far, Koloth has about the same 3-4 sentences of an entry in the book I cite here, but he has been safely redirected to the character list. Unless someone can find a source discussing her significance in the real world, all we have is your average, non-notable, minor fictional character that fails WP:GNG. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 06:09, 18 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Fictional elements-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:31, 22 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Television-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:31, 22 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Comics and animation-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:31, 22 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of United States of America-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:31, 22 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Science fiction-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 23:34, 22 April 2017 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep We also see... Inquisitr, LA Review of Books, Inverse, Moviepilot, Trek Fail, a paper on minor trek characters. In summary, the possibility that this ST:The Animated Series character will be introduced in J.J. Abrams' world to replace Anton Yelchin's Chekov seems to have prompted a reasonable outpouring of RS coverage. Note that TAS has been off the air for over fourty years, and M'Ress still has plenty of 2016-2017 coverage, which is a pretty good demonstration of notability, even if the recent sources don't go into as much depth. Jclemens (talk) 00:17, 23 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Beyond this speculation, which merits one sentence, there is nothing else except in-universe biography for this character. I am afraid this is just not enough. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 03:29, 25 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Merge to List of Star Trek characters (G–M). None of the sources currently in the article are usable at all as reliable sources, and nothing else available, including the ones introduced by Jclemens above, are remotely close to being significant coverage.  Nearly every source is nothing more than a sentence saying "this character existed in the animated series".  There is no in-depth analysis of the character, nothing showing any real-world importance or influence, and nothing showing any real reception to the character.  Only one of those sources speculates that the character might return in the reboot series to replace Chekov, and as there is no actual source beyond that hinting to that possibility at all, that seems like a very flimsy reasoning for claiming notability for the character.  64.183.45.226 (talk) 23:00, 24 April 2017 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America1000 10:32, 25 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Merge to List of Star Trek characters (G–M) per the comments from 64.183.45.226. Aoba47 (talk) 01:35, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Comment. I am totally fine with the merge (nominator). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 06:30, 26 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Comment The IP address' comments, and hence Aoba47's "me too" are essentially invalid, in that two of the sources (one book, the final paper) are paywalled. If a presumably reliable source is inaccessible, it is pretty difficult to conclusively say it's not important. Furthermore, the assertion that there is only one article around Yelchin's possible replacement with this character is inaccurate: I see at least six, but didn't feel the need to include all of them. Jclemens (talk) 01:45, 27 April 2017 (UTC)
 * I still do not see significant coverage on this character that would support having a separate article. Those six sources you linked are very weak. The Entertainment Weekly article only appears in the results as someone mentions the character in a comment and is thus invalid. The Trek Today "Retro Review" would be more appropriate for the episode articles in my opinion and their character's mention in the reviews are very minor. The lareviewofbooks source also does not provide much coverage on the character so I am not seeing much of an argument here. I still believe a merge and redirect is the best answer. I take issue with the comment on my opinion/agreement with above comments as "essentially invalid" as inappropriate as this should be a place of discussion and passing rather flippant judgement like that is not necessarily the best method of doing so. I just do not see any coverage outside of the fact that she appeared on the show and was discussed rather superficially as a possible replacement for Chekov; not a lot to fulfill notability in my opinion, but I would be more than happy to look through any other sources if you would like to list more (continued below).
 * Just to clarify my position even further, this is all that I see from the sources raised in this AfD: M'Ress is a character that appeared in Star Trek: The Animated Series and was voiced by Majet Barrett. The only reception that I have noticed is her being a cat woman and a joke about her potential to appeal to the furry crowd, and the only other attention to the character is again the rather superficial speculation on her appearance in future Star Trek media. I love articles on fictional characters and have worked on several in the past, and I think information on the character should be on the Wikipedia. However, I believe the information can be condensed down into a couple paragraphs in the pre-existing list of Star Trek characters as I do not see significant coverage to the point of keeping a separate article. If there is more about the creation and characterization of M'Ress or the reception of the character, then I would be more than happy to see it. I think we just have a difference in opinion on the "significant coverage" part of the policy on notability. Aoba47 (talk) 03:11, 28 April 2017 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Winged Blades Godric 09:38, 3 May 2017 (UTC)
 * Merge with the characters page already suggested, open to reevaluating if discussion about the character's use in the next film to replace Chekov is put in the article. 331dot (talk) 09:40, 3 May 2017 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.