Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/MS-18 Kämpfer


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   merge to Mobile Suit Gundam 0080: War in the Pocket.  Sandstein  16:18, 26 October 2008 (UTC)

MS-18 Kämpfer

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This fictional weapon does not establish notability independent of its series through the inclusion of real world information from reliable, third party sources. Most of the information is made up of original research and unnecessary plot details. There is no current assertion for future improvement. TTN (talk) 18:05, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Merge to Mobile Suit Gundam 0080: War in the Pocket (which already got a similar list) or something like List of Mobile Suit Gundam 0080 mobile weapons. MythSearchertalk 18:11, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep. It's notable within the series. It isn't part of the real world, and therefore doesn't require real world information from real world reliable sources. Details about fictional chracters and objects can be encyclopedic. All these nominations of fictional weapons and characters are a bit overwhelming, rather like 's tagging of images its creator thought had inadequate fair use rationales. -- Eastmain (talk) 18:18, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * All articles must follow WP:N. There are several different discussions working on reworking the guideline, but until such a time, it still needs to be followed. TTN (talk) 18:22, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, I highly doubt it to be highly notable in the series itself. It is notable in the Gundam Universe, but in the original 0080, the focus on mobile suits are much less than other Gundam anime series. MythSearchertalk 18:50, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I don't have a strong opinion about this particular article, but for your information, WP:N is still just a guideline, not a policy. We are not required to deal with these fiction articles immediately. Couldn't you limit yourself to one or two nominations per day? We're not dealing with BLP violations here. And most of these articles could at least be pared down and merged into other pages, so deletion tools aren't needed in the first place. Nominating 10+ articles a day just seems unnecessarily aggressive. Zagalejo^^^ 19:08, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Though this really isn't the place for this discussion, there is an extremely large amount of articles on fictional elements. More are created each day, while the rest just constantly fall into disrepair (if they weren't already created in that state). My main goal is to have fictional subtopics at a manageable level, and this is the only way to do it without taking ten literal years to do so. We're not in a rush, but there is no need to go at a snail's pace. With articles like these, the main details are way too crufty to actually merge half the time, so deletion really is the best path. TTN (talk) 19:29, 21 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Merge and redirect to Mobile Suit Gundam 0080: War in the Pocket. No notability outside that fictional universe. VG &#x260E; 19:32, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Merge to Mobile Suit Gundam 0080: War in the Pocket. Edward321 (talk) 23:46, 21 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete or merge a little I agree with TTN about the inappropriateness of articles such as this in Wikipedia. There will be occasional instances where the nature of individual items of weaponry and other background elements is of real significance, but these are going to be  quite rare. A very short description of the key weapons somewhere in the article is almost always sufficient; for some games such as this where the weapons are of interest generally might well use an article describing them in general. It is combination articles such as that where the individual sections do not have to meet WP:N, for if one thing is clear about all present and proposed versions of Notability, it applies to articles, not bits of content. The problem here is two-fold, the insistence on having this sort of fan detail about minor subjects in Wikipedia; and the insistence on removing all mention of the subject. This applies to episode plot and character articles as well--the attitude of those who write them frame by frame, or in a manner copied from program or game guides,  is matched by the equally inappropriate attitude of those who want to eliminate as much as possible. To make this a matter of WP:N is besides the point entirely though--the question is about what sort of content is appropriate in WP; if we agreed or could compromise on that, we could easily write a guideline that expresses our compromise. Worded differently, our ability to compromise is not impaired by the present  wording of any guideline. The guidelines are the guidelines for what we do. So much of these recurrent disputation could be solved by judicious merging of a little or a lot.   (Incidentally, i think it totally unnecessary to have redirects from specific weapon models such as this; nobody who does not already know the game well will be the least likely to encounter the term.) TTN--do you think there is a real possibility for those who think like you to reach a compromise at 50% of what you want, not 90%? If you do, I'll try to persuade your opponents similarly. But if each side wants 90% we will never get anything but continued war by attrition. DGG (talk) 03:54, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Mergeto List of Gundams of the UC timeline or List of Gundams of the UC One Year War era 70.55.200.131 (talk) 06:53, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
 * List of Gundam Universal Century mobile units is already quite large, as the UC timeline is quite large. May I suggest a better merge target, such as List of (series) mobile units (where "(series)" is the name of the series, as this is copypasta as your !vote)? 208.245.87.2 (talk) 15:56, 22 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep This is the arch-enemy mobile suit in this series. It is somewhat disappointing that so much of the current article is written in an in-game perspective. Having been in Japan at the time the War in the Pocket video series came out, I can say that this was a big thing and had made appearances in various anime and modeling magazines. The article needs a complete overhaul but the topic is notable. --Polaron | Talk 16:32, 22 October 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.