Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mackinac Financial Corporation (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. This is a NOTAVOTE close. IMO the weight of argument lies with the Keep and analysis of sources provided near the bottom of the discussion. Ad Orientem (talk) 00:44, 5 July 2018 (UTC)

Mackinac Financial Corporation
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Non-notable company. This article was deleted previously (see ), and then restored to be userfied because it was created as a course assignment and the user needed evidence of the article for course credit (see [to userfy the page|Request to userfy the page]). However, the article was then moved back to article space with no improvement. I would argue that this qualifies as a WP:CSD deletion, but I'll allow the discussion first. WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 19:58, 13 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Companies-related deletion discussions.  WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 21:04, 13 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Michigan-related deletion discussions.  WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 21:04, 13 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Finance-related deletion discussions.  MT Train Talk 05:33, 14 June 2018 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Spartaz Humbug! 23:06, 20 June 2018 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep 80 year old bank with 29 branches and assets of $1.3B. [] Should probably be renamed to mBank (US Bank), the better known entity that Mackinac is a holding company for. TimTempleton (talk) (cont)  06:01, 27 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Comment Are 80 years, 29 branches and $1.3B assets listed as criteria for notability somewhere? Where's the significant coverage? WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 11:42, 27 June 2018 (UTC)
 * I think a bank with $1b in holdings should meet the notability threshold, but it's not set in stone. Here's some coverage, mostly about their acquisitions, but they are pretty big now: [], [], [] and [], although now I'm thinking Mackinac is the correct title. TimTempleton (talk)  (cont)  19:17, 27 June 2018 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Striker force Talk 20:34, 27 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete: Does not meet new and improved WP:NCORP; promo 'cruft based on WP:SPIP sourcing and routine notices. $1.3B in assets is rather insignificant. Just a nn financial institution going about its business. K.e.coffman (talk) 22:45, 30 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete - I'd like to think that the largest bank headquartered in the UP counts for something, but actually it doesn't. Just lacks non-routine, independent sources. Smallbones( smalltalk ) 04:17, 1 July 2018 (UTC)

<li>Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. According to https://www.bankmbank.com/About-mBank/History.aspx, mBank was originally chartered in 1934 under the name of First National Bank in Manistique. By 1998, it was renamed to North Country Bank and Trust. In 2005, it was renamed to mBank. Mackinac Financial Corporation is mBank's holding company. Here are some sources about the subject: <ol> <li> The article notes: "Manistique - Wer bei der 'North Country Bank and Trust' im US-Staat Michigan ein Festgeldkonto eröffnet, erhält eine Schrotflinte als Prämie. Bei Abschluss eines mehrjährigen Vertrages erhalten Anleger ein Gewehr der Nobelmarke Weatherby. Im Gegenzug verzichten sie auf eine spätere Zinsausschüttung. Seit 1990 ködert die kleine Regionalbank potenzielle Kunden mit großen Kalibern statt mit hohen Zinsen. Rund tausend Kunden aus 50 Bundesstaaten hätten sich für die Sofort-Dividende entschieden, sagt Anlageberaterin Rosemary Garvin. Damit habe das landesweit in Jagdzeitschriften inserierte Programm der Bank bisher 'Millionen von Dollar' eingebracht. Weatherby fertigt für die 'North Country Bank' mittlerweile sogar exklusiv eine limitierte Sonderversion des Gewehrs 'Lazermark' (mit feinster Eichenlaubgravur) an. Für die Tierschützer unter den Sparern wurden vorsorglich Standuhren, Golfschläger und Ferngläser in den Prämienkatalog aufgenommen."</li> <li> A copy of the article at https://www.newspapers.com/image/133299924/ (clipping at https://www.newspapers.com/clip/21471428/) indicates the writer of this Associated Press article is John Flesher. The article notes: "The .12-gauge shotgun and the .270-caliber rifle on the wall rack at North Country Bank and Trust's downtown branch are not just teller-window dressing. Plunk down a couple of thousand dollars for a 20-year certificate of deposit and either one could be yours. North Country offers CD buyers a choice: interest payments that accrue in the usual way, or pricey merchandise such as grandfather clocks, golf clubs and, especially, guns. North Country's 'instant interest' catalog lists more than 100 rifle and 18 shotgun models made by Weatherby Inc. of Atascadero, Calif. The decade-old program has attracted depositors from all 50 states, bank president Ronald Ford says. Not bad for a bank whose 31 branches are all in northern Michigan. ...  North Country advertises its program in hunting and gun collector magazines. It has handed out more than 7,000 firearms and taken in millions of dollars in deposits while receiving up to 40,000 inquiries a year, Ford says."</li> <li> The article notes: "Mackinac Financial Corp., a bank holding company based in Manistique in the Upper Peninsula, hopes to use an investment from a legendary hedge fund manager to jumpstart its expansion plans for Southeast Michigan. Mackinac (Nasdaq: MFNC), the holding company for mBank, has seven branches in the U.P., three in the northern Lower Peninsula and just one in metro Detroit — in Birmingham, where the company's chairman and CEO, Paul Tobias, has his office. ... Mackinac Financial recently announced it has begun a $7 million rights offering of common stock for its current shareholders. In conjunction with that offering, the company in March entered into a securities purchase agreement with Steinhardt Capital Investors LLLP, a private equity firm based in New York.  ...  Mackinac has more than $495 million in assets. According to its annual report to the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission, the company had net income of $1.5 million in 2011."</li> <li> The article notes: "The Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. (FDIC) and the Michigan Office of Financial and Insurance Services (OFIS) have issued a cease-and-desist order to North Country Financial Corp., the holding company for Manistique-based North Country Bank and Trust which has 26 branch offices around the state, including one in Gaylord. ... The Associated Press reported Monday, among other problems, North Country has issued $17.5 million in loans to 'current and former directors, officers, and employees of the bank and their relatives.' Dividend payments to shareholders were suspended last year."</li> <li> The book notes: "The First National Bank of Manistique opened in 1900 on the corner of South Cedar and Walnut Streets. The bank was reorganized in 1930 and became the First National Bank in Manistique and received its charter in 1934. The upstairs was rented out as offices for professionals. (Adolf Sandberg Collection.)"</li> <li>Coverage about Michael Moore's visit to North Country Bank and Trust in the film Bowling for Columbine:<ol> <li> The book notes: "Masculine pride in gun ownership is everywhere in the film, from the boys with toy rifles to homegrown radicals like Nichols to the mild-mannered bank clerk who tells Moore about his owning the same 'straight shooter' of a rifle that Moore receives as a reward for opening a bank account at the North Country Bank and Trust. The pride of possessing something that so overtly speaks masculinity extends to Moore himself. In Bowling for Columbine, on exiting the bank, he triumphantly holds his just-acquired rifle over his head in a gesture that echoes Charles Heston's famous speech at the 2000 annual meeting of the NRA when, upon receiving an antique rifle as a gift, he declared that the gun control lobby would succeed in getting his weapon only if they pried it out of his 'cold dead hands.'"</li> <li> The article notes: "Michigan's North Country Bank was offering a free gun with a new checking account — more bang for the buck, read the ad — so naturally Michael Moore had to apply. And he had to ask the friendly officer who helped him with the application: 'You think it's a little dangerous handing out guns at a bank?'"</li> <li> The article notes: "BANK: Moore says North Country Bank & Trust in Traverse City, Mich., offered a deal where, 'if you opened an account, the bank would give you a gun.' He walks into a branch and walks out with a gun. ACTUALLY: Moore didn't just walk in off the street and get a gun. The transaction was staged for cameras. You have to buy a long-term CD, then go to a gun shop to pick up the weapon after a background check."</li> </ol></li> <li> The article notes: "North Country Financial Corp. of Manistique, Mich., has hired a former state bank regulator to help rehabilitate its $522 million-asset North Country Bank and Trust. ... North Country Bank has run into asset quality problems recently. Federal and state regulators, citing shoddy lending practices and poor management, issued a cease-and-desist order against it in March."</li> <li> The article notes: "10 Years Ago June 30, 2005 Tuesday marked a transition from one era to the next, as workers removed the old North Country Bank and Trust sign from the Cedar Street branch and replaced it with a sign bearing the company’s new name, mBank. The change was the latest for an institution that began in 1934 as the First National Bank at Manistique. The North Country title was unveiled in August 1996, when the name was changed from First Northern Bank and Trust. The company officially became mBank last month."</li> <li> The article notes: "MANISTIQUE, Nov. 23—Gottfried S. Johnson, Manistique attorney, received notification by wire from J. F. T. O'Connor, comptroller of currency at Washington that he had been appointed as receiver of the First National Bank in Manistique. As the commission of Mauritz Carlson as conservator of the old bank expired on the same date, Attorney Johnson will take over the trust immediately. The receivership is of the remaining 40 per cent of the assets of the old First National Bank in Manistique which are in the process of liquidation. On October 13 of this year 60 per cent of the assets of the old bank were released to depositors in the reorganization and the establishment of the new bank or the First National Bank at Manistique."</li> </ol>There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Mackinac Financial Corporation to pass Notability, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject". Cunard (talk) 04:37, 2 July 2018 (UTC) </li></ul> <ul><li>The sources that discuss the gun program provide ongoing significant coverage of the bank's product. From Notability (organizations and companies): "Examples of substantial coverage that would generally be sufficient to meet the requirement: A scholarly article, a book passage, or ongoing media coverage focusing on a product or organization, [other examples]" The sources here provide "ongoing media coverage focusing" on the company's gun program. There are articles in the newspaper Der Spiegel and the news agency Associated Press in 2001 and coverage by Michael Moore in the documentary film Bowling for Columbine in 2002. They discuss the bank's advertising strategy and provide in-depth coverage of how the program works and the participation in it. Analyst reports also can be used to establish notability. From Notability (organizations and companies) (my bolding): "There has been considerable discussion over time whether publicly traded corporations, or at least publicly traded corporations listed on major stock exchanges such as the NYSE and other comparable international stock exchanges, are inherently notable. Consensus has been that notability is not automatic in this (or any other) case. However, sufficient independent sources almost always exist for such companies, so that notability can be established using the primary criterion discussed above. Examples of such sources include independent press coverage and analyst reports. Accordingly, article authors should make sure to seek out such coverage and add references to such articles to properly establish notability." This articleWebCite from The Fly notes: "Mackinac Financial initiated with an Overweight at Piper Jaffray Piper Jaffray analyst Nathan Race started Mackinac Financial with an Overweight rating and $20 price target. The analyst highlights the company's 'scarcity value' in the upper and lower peninsulas of Michigan as well as Northern Wisconsin and its 'stronger' net interest margin profile." This is an analyst report from senior research analyst Nathan Race of the investment bank Piper Jaffray. The full report can be accessed by Piper Jaffray clients at https://www.piperjaffray.com/2col.aspx?id=273. From this articleWebCite in American Banking News: "Research analysts at Piper Jaffray Companies issued their Q2 2018 earnings per share (EPS) estimates for Mackinac Financial in a report issued on Wednesday, June 20th. Piper Jaffray Companies analyst N. Race forecasts that the financial services provider will post earnings of $0.29 per share for the quarter. Piper Jaffray Companies has a “Overweight” rating and a $20.00 price objective on the stock. Piper Jaffray Companies also issued estimates for Mackinac Financial’s Q3 2018 earnings at $0.31 EPS, Q4 2018 earnings at $0.32 EPS, FY2018 earnings at $1.20 EPS, Q1 2019 earnings at $0.31 EPS, Q2 2019 earnings at $0.33 EPS, Q3 2019 earnings at $0.35 EPS, Q4 2019 earnings at $0.36 EPS and FY2019 earnings at $1.35 EPS. ... Other research analysts have also recently issued research reports about the company. Hovde Group began coverage on Mackinac Financial in a research note on Tuesday, April 3rd. They issued an “outperform” rating and a $19.00 price target on the stock. …" The two analyst reports mentioned above are listed at https://www.marketbeat.com/stocks/NASDAQ/MFNC/price-target/ under a paywallWebCite:
 * Comment The criteria for companies/organizations is described at WP:NCORP where it clarifies that "independent" should be taken to mean "intellectually independent" and provides examples of the types of references which do not meet the criteria for establishing notability. Most of the references you've provided above fail WP:CORPDEPTH as they're talking about the novelty of a bank providing a firearm to its customers and nothing about the bank itself. Or the inclusion of a photo in a book is a mere mention-in-passing. Etc. None of your references meet the criteria. Please read WP:NCORP. <b style="font-family: Courier; color: darkgreen;"> HighKing</b>++ 17:55, 2 July 2018 (UTC)

The two analyst reports are sufficient to establish notability per Notability (organizations and companies). Cunard (talk) 08:27, 3 July 2018 (UTC) </li></ul>
 * Tips Hat Analyst reports, yes, that works. I'll change my !vote. Your point about whether coverage of a product can be used to establish notabilty of an organization is incorrect. The opening lines of NCORP state: This page is to help determine whether an organization (commercial or otherwise), or any of its products and services, is a valid subject for a separate Wikipedia article dedicated solely to that organization, product, or service. But, analyst reports - thank you. <b style="font-family: Courier; color: darkgreen;"> HighKing</b>++ 11:21, 3 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete None of the references meet the new WP:NCORP criteria for establishing notability including the very very long listing by Cunard above. Topic fails GNG and WP:NCORP. <b style="font-family: Courier; color: darkgreen;"> HighKing</b>++ 13:01, 2 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Keep Cunard above has located analyst reports. There meet the criteria for establishing notability. <b style="font-family: Courier; color: darkgreen;"> HighKing</b>++ 11:21, 3 July 2018 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.