Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Marquis de Sade in popular culture


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.  

The result was no consensus, default to keep - Nabla 17:02, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

Marquis de Sade in popular culture

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Trivia collection, imparting no additional knowledge about the subject's cultural impact. Violates WP:NOT. Eyrian 20:28, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete WP:WING Avi 20:49, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Sadistic Keep There were all sorts of ways that this could go off course, but it's a surprisingly straight forward article. The list of film and theatrical productions is proof enough of the fascination that the mean Marquis still generates 200 years later.  Thus, it qualifies as a good start.  Mandsford 21:36, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep per Mandsford and by the way, I like the "Sadistic" in your post! It is good to see the creativity!  Best, --  Le Grand Roi des Citrouilles  Tally-ho! 21:47, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete This is simply a list of appearences that the subject has made in various media. Unless there were actual information about the subject in popular culture, the list has no significance, and is a collection of trivial information. As for illustrating the subject's appearances in fiction, this is covered sufficiently in the subject's main article under the section "fictional works". There is no need for an entire article to give an intensely detailed list of such appearences, because the main article gets the point across just fine. Calgary 21:48, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep. Its mainstream productions of film and theatre, not references in manga and Simpson episodes. --Richard Arthur Norton (1958- ) 21:50, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep for two reasons. (1) This article was created largely as a way to keep this content out of the main Sade article. Without a repository like this, the main article would tend to accumulate this content. (2) At least most of this is pretty notable. For example, most of the plays and films are either biographical or based on Sade's works. If there were only a few of these, they would, indeed, belong in the article on Sade himself, but there are so many that they tend to weigh down the article.

In short, when there are only a few significant popular cultural references to a subject, they belong in the article on the subject itself. When there are a lot then, much like any other section that threatens to swamp an article, they deserve to be factored out into an article of their own. That is exactly what happened here. This may not be a perfect example of how to do this, but it's a good one. - Jmabel | Talk 22:45, 15 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete as being a list of loosely associated topics.  This is just a list of every time that person X has appeared in a fictional work Corpx 04:10, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep - The Marquis de Sade has been featured prominently throughout popular culture and has even had his name entered into the lexicon. This is not some forced article about someone whose persona is really not part of the popular culture. Ante  lan  talk  04:34, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep - I fail to see how this is "loosely associated". The association between these topics is quite clear, since (nearly) every item listed has de Sade as a central theme in the work.  If it were merely a list of every time de Sade had been mentioned, I'd agree the association would be loose, but we're talking about the central themes of cultural works.  I'd suggest removing any references that are trivial (e.g. about half of the items in the last section), but otherwise keeping the article as it stands. JulesH 10:35, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep - while many if not most popular culture articles should indeed be deleted, this one in well done and doesn't include the usual pointless trivia. IPSOS (talk) 13:18, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Comment: While I voted keep, it would be nice if someone would turn this into more of an article and less of just a list. For example, it would make sense to discuss how the image of Sade has changed over time, how he has been used as both a sympathetic and unsympathetic character, etc. - Jmabel | Talk 18:14, 16 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep yes, we all can and will turn it into a better article, though it will take more than a few days. Though this series of nominations might have been intended to remove the content from such articles, they will end up in improving and augmenting them. DGG (talk) 04:36, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete Look, most items in history have been referenced in various popular cultures at one time or another. This is just glorified trivia that does not need it's own article.  Violates many policies, including WP:TRIVA and WP:NOT and most "IPC" articles have been deleted rightfully. Biggspowd 21:55, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete Just a collection of loosely associated topics, fails WP:NOT. Jay32183 22:19, 17 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete per above. &mdash; Deckiller 02:38, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep Just off the top of my head, Angela Carter wrote an entire book about the influence the Marquis de Sade had on popular culture. If the WP:NOT problems can be fixed through editing and finding sources, shouldn't that be done rather than deleting the entire article? I'll give it a go -- Bláthnaid 11:48, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep This is without a doubt an important topic. While it would be better served as a prose discussion about his influence on different movements and in different periods, it should not be deleted. Atropos 05:29, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep. It's clear that a meaningful and well-sourced encyclopedia article can be written on this subject, and this article is on its way towards that goal. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 05:32, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Please do! - Jmabel | Talk 05:34, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep - these "popular culture" articles frequently collect a lot of inane trivia, but they serve the very useful purpose of providing a repository for it, thus preventing the main article from becoming cluttered with it. Peterkingiron 15:12, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Better here than there is not a valid argument for keeping an article. If inappropriate content appears in an article it should be deleted, not given its own article. Jay32183 17:21, 19 August 2007 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.