Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Martin MacNeill (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Speedy Keep. #SK (non-admin closure)  Jim Carter (from public cyber)  16:22, 28 September 2014 (UTC)

Martin MacNeill
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I don't believe this person meets our criteria for inclusion in the encyclopedia. He was convicted of murdering his wife and various other charges, but the coverage of the case was mostly local and timely. He was not nationally notorious and his case does not appear to have had any lasting impact. MelanieN (talk) 15:00, 27 September 2014 (UTC)
 * See also Articles for deletion/Michele Marie Somers, which is about his wife / victim. --MelanieN (talk) 15:04, 27 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Keep I'm a little confused why this is nominated again since it was decided to "keep" earlier. The template is "find sources", there may be issues with article, but lack of sources isn't it. This has been a case that has had national media attention (see Query for national news), like many other articles on Wikipedia Scott Peterson, others I've already mentioned. I personally would have preferred that the article (previous "Michele MacNeil" article} about the victim remained, if one had to go, but that was deleted.


 * Is there something that I'm missing about this?-- CaroleHenson  ( talk ) 15:20, 27 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Actually it was not decided to "keep" at the earlier discussion; the result was "no consensus". --MelanieN (talk) 15:43, 27 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Yep, good clarification! I was thinking in terms of the net effect.-- CaroleHenson  ( talk ) 16:06, 27 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Added: (previous "Michele MacNeil" article} to avoid confusion, since another article has been created about her since then.-- CaroleHenson  ( talk ) 22:06, 27 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Utah-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 15:28, 27 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Crime-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 15:28, 27 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 15:28, 27 September 2014 (UTC)


 * Comment. I have no objection to merging and redirecting Martin MacNeill and Michele Marie Somers to Murder of Michele MacNeill. The notability of the individuals is dependent upon the event, and the event (i.e. murder and trial, etc.) certainly has received national and some international coverage, and appears to pass the various guidelines in WP:EVENT. Unfortunately, I have no interest in creating or re-working the merge target. - Location (talk) 18:06, 27 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment. I would be happy to merge and rename the article - and rewrite it to fit the event title.-- CaroleHenson  ( talk ) 19:46, 27 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Keep - I see no reason for merging or deleting this article. It stands on its own. Per WP:GNG and WP:CRIME,--BabbaQ (talk) 20:18, 27 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment If the result is to keep this material, I certainly agree with User:Location that it should be combined into a single article titled Murder of Michele MacNeill. That is the usual Wikipedia practice, reflecting the understanding that it is the crime itself that is notable - rather than the victim or the perpetrator, whose only claim to notability is their connection to the crime. If this course is chosen, I would recommend that this article, Martin MacNeill, be moved to the new title, because it has a much more significant article history. The contents of the article Michele Marie Somers should then be merged and redirected to the "Murder of" article. A redirect titled Michele MacNeill should also be created. --MelanieN (talk) 09:31, 28 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment I think MelanieN is right about merging both articles about husband and wife to the Murder of Michele MacNeill article since neither individual, in themselves, seems to be notable, but what is notable is the horrific act -- which got [https://www.google.com/search?q=Michele+MacNeill+(marie+OR+somers+OR+martin+OR+murder+OR+utah+OR+2007+OR+1957)+(site%3Anytimes.com+OR+site%3Ausatoday.com+OR+site%3Aphiladelphiainquirer.com+OR+site%3Atime.com+OR+site%3Amiamiherald.com+OR+site%3Apittsburghpostgazette.com+OR+site%3Achicagotribune.com+OR+site%3Alatimes.com+OR+site%3Asfgate.com+OR+site%3Awsj.com+OR+site%3Amercurynews.com+OR+site%3Awashingtonpost.com+OR+site%3Asuntimes.com+OR+site%3Anj.com+OR+site%3Aboston.com+OR+site%3Anydailynews.com+OR+site%3Adenverpost.com+OR+site%3Anpr.org+OR+site%3Abaltimoresun.com+OR+site%3Acsmonitor.com)&rlz=1CAASUA_enUS604US605&oq=Michele+MacNeill+(marie+OR+somers+OR+martin+OR+murder+OR+utah+OR+2007+OR+1957)+(site%3Anytimes.com+OR+site%3Ausatoday.com+OR+site%3Aphiladelphiainquirer.com+OR+site%3Atime.com+OR+site%3Amiamiherald.com+OR+site%3Apittsburghpostgazette.com+OR+site%3Achicagotribune.com+OR+site%3Alatimes.com+OR+site%3Asfgate.com+OR+site%3Awsj.com+OR+site%3Amercurynews.com+OR+site%3Awashingtonpost.com+OR+site%3Asuntimes.com+OR+site%3Anj.com+OR+site%3Aboston.com+OR+site%3Anydailynews.com+OR+site%3Adenverpost.com+OR+site%3Anpr.org+OR+site%3Abaltimoresun.com+OR+site%3Acsmonitor.com)&aqs=chrome..69i57.405j0j9&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=0&ie=UTF-8#q=Michele+MacNeill+(marie+OR+somers+OR+martin+OR+murder+OR+utah+OR+2007+OR+1957)+(site%3Anytimes.com+OR+site%3Ausatoday.com+OR+site%3Aphiladelphiainquirer.com+OR+site%3Atime.com+OR+site%3Amiamiherald.com+OR+site%3Apittsburghpostgazette.com+OR+site%3Achicagotribune.com+OR+site%3Alatimes.com+OR+site%3Asfgate.com+OR+site%3Awsj.com+OR+site%3Amercurynews.com+OR+site%3Awashingtonpost.com+OR+site%3Asuntimes.com+OR+site%3Anj.com+OR+site%3Aboston.com+OR+site%3Anydailynews.com+OR+site%3Adenverpost.com+OR+site%3Anpr.org+OR+site%3Abaltimoresun.com+OR+site%3Acsmonitor.com)&start=20 national attention], and even international attention, and played out over several years. It is the kind of high profile case that could easily be made into a movie, since it was a doctor, using medicine to kill his own wife, with a mistress, numerous children, the religion angle, etc etc. So I am thinking merge the husband and wife articles into a single one about the murder.--Tomwsulcer (talk) 12:44, 28 September 2014 (UTC)
 * Withdraw nomination I withdraw my "delete" nomination in favor of "keep this article, move it to Murder of Michele MacNeill, and merge the other article into it." We already have a volunteer to carry out the process. --MelanieN (talk) 14:13, 28 September 2014 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.