Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Martina Rosenberger


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep.  MBisanz  talk 00:09, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

Martina Rosenberger

 * ( [ delete] ) – (View AfD) (View log)

Two primary claims are as a songwriter and author. No indication that the subject meets WP:Music or WP:Creative. Both books are indicated to be self-published. Taroaldo (talk) 22:25, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep. If nominator had only typed in the lady's name in Google News, s/he would have found this, with three bona fide references to the subject. Granted, that's not a whole lot, and I'd love to see more, but it seems to me that someone with such an esoteric skill ought to get a little leeway: two references from the Augsburger Allgemeine and one in Freies Wort is good enough for me, esp. if you throw in the results from a regular Google search. Drmies (talk) 00:23, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Comment I don't speak German; is there much more than "according to a local newspaper, N.N. plays the cittern" that can be verified from reliable sources? 88.112.62.225 (talk) 07:32, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
 * From the first hit: "To remedy this situation, for the last couple of years the goldsmith from Krumbach worked diligently on the conception of a modern study book for the Waldzither, which was created in cooperation with the Thuringian organization of music schools and was presented at the conference." That is a random paragraph; the conference was organized by the subject, the "situation" to be remedied was that there was no study material for this particular instrument. So that's much more than "M.R. plays this instrument," yes. Drmies (talk) 20:59, 24 March 2009 (UTC)

Several people have used her work without referencing it - including on Wikipedia. This article serves to document her as an active researcher and author, as well as musician, songwriter, etc. I would like to add external links to the article but was not able to. These would include a link to her web site, which has several newspaper clippings about her and her work, and to waldzither.de, where she is referenced a great deal. Comment I think the article needs editing rather than deletion. Rosenberger's main claim to fame is as a key figure in the recent revival of the waldzither tradition and one of only two people to have done extensive research in this important part of the German musical heritage. This may not be clearly enough stated in the article.
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions.  --  Fabrictramp  |  talk to me  00:09, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Authors-related deletion discussions.  --  Fabrictramp  |  talk to me  00:09, 27 March 2009 (UTC)


 * Is there an article about this person at de.wp? Given the information presented here and on the article, I'm leaning towards delete -- we have a limited capacity to maintain bare adequacy on articles about living people who are marginally notable, and more often its better to delete them until their status changes. Avruch  T 17:26, 27 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so consensus may be reached. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, –  Juliancolton  | Talk 01:31, 28 March 2009 (UTC)

*Delete, neither notable as a goldsmith, nor as a musician, nor as an author. Deletion Mutation 15:21, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Comment what is needed here is really some attention from a specialist who can deal with the material. OCLC shows no copies of her work except in the Bavarian and German national libraries; Julliard catalog gives no results for either her or the instrument. Beyond that, I'm out of my depth, but I suspect it's the not uncommon situation where something ought to become notable, but may not be quite yet. DGG (talk) 02:18, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep per Drmies, and apply WP:BLP rigidly by cutting out everything important that we can't find a source to. Is anybody fluent in German?  I'm not good with the language style used in newspapers.  Them  From  Space  04:58, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Blocked sockpuppet. NuclearWarfare  ( Talk ) 20:16, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Note--I hadn't looked to carefully at the other Augsburger Allgemeine article: it's pretty trivial and it may not be our Martina. What we have left (study German or take my word for it ;) ) in terms of coverage via Google News are two bona fide, fairly in-depth articles on the lady and her work in what I consider to be reliable sources. I have not done the library search DGG has, and I have yet to look carefully at the 'regular' Google hits; I do believe some are worthwhile there. So I continue to lean toward keep, even if weakly. I'll be glad to work some more on the article, but I can't do it in for another couple of days, unfortunately. Drmies (talk) 04:56, 30 March 2009 (UTC)


 * Keep I am compiling a list of references to include in the article. If you check the external links, you will see some of the newspaper articles there. You can find information about her and the conferences on waldzither.de and www.guitarraportuguesa.com/  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cittern (talk • contribs) 07:29, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Sure, but we need reliable sources, and the finding of the articles is not the issue--I've already given that link, above. (BTW, there is nothing in these 'references' right now except for links to websites and a dead link to something that's not a newspaper.) Drmies (talk) 17:25, 30 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep Her personal webpage has PDFs of the articles under Press. Here is a list of news paper articles:

Freies Wort, Mo, 13.10.2003 / S.9 „Tradition der Zithermusik in Deutschland besonders im Bergbau weit verbreitet“ Freies Wort, Di, 14.10.2003 / S.14 „Es „zitherte“ kräftig in Suhl“ Waldzither in Theorie und Praxis vorgestellt/Internet-Seite ist geplant von Liane Kotsch Freies Wort, Do, 16.10.2003 Profile „Neue Puzzles für das Zither-Spiel“ Freies Wort, Sa, 29.10.2005 / S.32 „Wenn es im Thüringer Wald zithert“ von Cindy Henkel Mittelschwäbische Nachrichten, Fr., 4.11.2005/ S.21 Kultur „Wenn es im Thüringer Wald zithert“ Übernahme des Artikels vom „Freien Wort“ von Cindy Henkel Freies Wort, 25.10.2007 / S.19 „Die Thüringer Waldzither“ Symposium/Fachleute kommen nach Suhl Red Freies Wort, 01.11.2007 „Lang Vergessenes im Focus“ Symposium/ Am Wochenende gibt es Konzerte und Vorträge zur Waldzither Von Stefan Reisner Wochenspiegel, 01.11.2007 „Waldzithersymposium zum 3. Mal in Suhl“ Freies Wort, Sa., 03.11.2007 / Titelseite „Ein Wald voller Zithern“ Foto ari Freies Wort Fr. 02.11.2007 / S. 16 Freies Wort, Sa., 03.11.2007/ S. 15 „Ein alter Schatz erklingt ganz neu“ Geschichten zum Wochenende der letzte Waldzitherbauer ist der Suhler Hilmar Günther von Heike Hüchtemann Freies Wort, Titel, 03.11.2007 „Ein Wald voller Zithern“ Foto:ari Wochenspiegel Nr 45, 06.11.2007 WSSHL3-2 „Wie aus einem Erbstück und purer Neugier eine Lebensaufgabe wurde“ Freies Wort, 08.11.2007 „Altes Instrument hat wieder eine Zukunft“ Symposium - die fast vergessene Waldzither feiert ein Comeback unter Eingeweihten Mittelschwäbische Nachrichten,24.11.2007/ S.8 „Waldzither/Botschafterin Martina Rosenberger“ Mittelschwäbische Nachrichten,14.11.2007/ S.36 Die innere Stimme der Tausendwunderfrau Musik: mit der Waldzither in die Welt von Andreas Langer

These are libraries that hold here books:

Augsburg, Staats- und Stadtbibliothek Hamburg, Museum für Kunst und Gewerbe München, Bayerische Staatsbibliothek Münster, ULB Zwickau, Westsächsische Hochschule Zwickau

MDR did a short program about her and her work - I'm trying to locate the reference. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cittern (talk • contribs) 07:04, 1 April 2009 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.