Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Media representation of Hugo Chávez (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. ➨ REDVEЯS is a satellite and will be set alight 13:03, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

Media representation of Hugo Chávez
AfDs for this article: 
 * ( [ delete] ) – (View AfD) (View log)

First of all, this page is irredeemably POV. It entirely fails to note that Chávez has garnered plenty of positive press in the West:, , , , , , , , for instance. It strings together a bunch of loosely-connected incidents and makes it seem, in violation of WP:SYN, that there's some sort of media conspiracy against Chávez, when the picture is hardly as clear. It also distorts reality. For instance the last two paragraphs (totally unreferenced) present Chávez' December referendum as no big deal and liken the change to the status quo in the UK or Germany, when in fact, quite a legitimate case can be made that this was a power grab (but in any event, it's not our job to make either argument). We have here a content fork and an essay rather than serious scholarship. Second, the page fails WP:N - of course a major figure like Chávez will be portrayed by the media in one way or another, but that doesn't normally require an article on him. If we can live without Media representations of George W. Bush or Media representations of Benito Mussolini, then surely we can do without this as well. Finally, much of the content is duplicate and exists elsewhere - we already have articles on the coup attempt, on Aló Presidente, on RCTV, etc. Biruitorul (talk) 20:14, 16 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Strong Keep. I see no problem with this article.  The subject is notable, verifiable, and inherently involves reliable media sources.  If your 8 sources would help to reduce a perceived POV problem in the article, why are you presenting them here rather than adding them to the article?  Cel  Talk to me  20:30, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Because it still would have WP:SYN problems - what we need is multiple third-party sources showing that the subject has been of interest to researchers, not an assortment of Wikipedians stringing together articles to make it seem like this is something notable. We need outside confirmation of notability. Biruitorul (talk) 20:56, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
 * You mention WP:SYN, but this doesn't really advance a position or contain a thesis. What position do you see this putting forth?  Also, articles of this type should be noted, which allude to the material contained within the article.  I don't see a notability issue, as articles like the aforementioned abound; I am, however, concerned with the SYN symptoms that the parent is mentioning.   Cel  Talk to me  21:52, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
 * The position seems rather clear: that Western media is portraying Chávez as an emerging dictator bent on curtailing freedoms and assuming ever-greater powers, when "in fact" (ie, the POV advanced by the SYN) he's a democratically-elected president like any other who's got a bad rap and an array of media outlets (and governments) ganging up against him. Biruitorul (talk) 00:02, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, even if the article seems POV-pushing to some, that issue has a solution other than deletion. A simple improvement drive on the article can solve that problem.  This issue is notable and verifiable, as can be established with sources.  Cel  Talk to me  01:36, 17 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Comment It might be better to retitle this Media coverage of Hugo Chávez; the "representation" is a bit outside what most sources will tell us. See Category:Media coverage and representation. I'm not entirely convinced that this article needs to exist, but I think it is possible for one to exist. Right now it's not much more than a list of incidents. --Dhartung | Talk 23:12, 16 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep as it has real world significance and verifiability. Sincerely, --  Le Grand Roi des Citrouilles  Tally-ho! 00:55, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete as WP:OR, WP:N, and WP:SYN. The sources given are not about his media coverage - they are simply examples of his coverage in the media.  There is no claim to the notability of the subject of the article, namely, the media representation of an individual.  The individual himself is without a doubt notable, but his "media representation" (the subject of the article) is not.  His media coverage, in other words, isn't the "story" - his actions are.  By claiming Chavez's media representation warrants an article on its own, I believe, is an example of WP:SYN, particularly as the article seems to be another article describing his actions.  BWH76 (talk) 11:31, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Merge and redirect to Hugo Chávez (which is essentially keep). The article is too short and redundant to justfy it being a spin-out of the main article.  It also could use some NPOV balance.  Ursasapien (talk) 11:40, 17 March 2008 (UTC)
 * delete - Dhartung makes a very good point, but BWH76 puts forward a very good response to it. If there were third-party reliable sources who were discussing the quality of Hugo Chavez's representation in the media, I think this would be a good article to have. Unfortunately, if this is nothing more than a summary, then yes, WP:SYN and Wikipedia shouldn't have it. AllGloryToTheHypnotoad (talk) 14:40, 20 March 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.