Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mohammad Ziauddin (army officer)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. SouthernNights (talk) 20:24, 4 November 2022 (UTC)

Mohammad Ziauddin (army officer)

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

Bangladeshi military officer fails WP:NBIO with no significant coverage in independent reliable sources. GeoffreyT2000 (talk) 16:29, 21 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: People, Military,  and Bangladesh. GeoffreyT2000 (talk) 16:30, 21 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment- The creator of the article has created four other articles, one has been deleted, and the rest are all related to Mohammad Ziauddin (army officer). The other articles they created are Mohammad Mafzalur Rahman, Waleed Ehsanul Karim, and Fazlul Karim (lawyer). They are poorly sourced, seem to have photos from the family album and reek of conflict of interest.Vinegarymass911 (talk) 17:32, 21 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Maybe keep. He is the main subject of this source which has indepth coverage: . However, I am not familiar with this website and am uncertain of whether it is a reliable secondary source (I believe it may be a primary source?). The sourcing here is not great. That said, I think there is a case that he meets criteria one for WP:ANYBIO as the recipient of the Bir Uttom which is verified to this government website: .4meter4 (talk) 17:34, 21 October 2022 (UTC)
 * The website belongs to Prothom Alo, is considered RS.Vinegarymass911 (talk) 18:44, 21 October 2022 (UTC)


 * Delete - not enough in-depth coverage to pass WP:GNG. Onel 5969  TT me 21:27, 21 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep- He has received the second-highest military award and the highest military award for living personnel. One of the seven receivers of the highest gallantry award in Bangladesh served and died under his command during the war. The subject was a decorated veteran of the Bangladesh Liberation war who lost his commission in the Bangladesh Army after writing an article critical of Bangladesh-India ties. Two years later, the President of Bangladesh, Sheikh Mujibur Rahman, is killed by army officers, following years of tension and suspicion between the army and the government. One of the problems they had with the president was the Bangladesh-India ties. While the article is not in the best shape, I am inclined to believe he is notable.Vinegarymass911 (talk) 02:21, 25 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Notability isn't a measure of what the article says, it's a measure of how well the article references the things it says to third party reliable sources. Even a winner of a high-level military award still has to be shown to pass WP:GNG on his sourcing before he actually gets a Wikipedia article for it, and doesn't get over the bar on primary sources or glancing namechecks of his existence in news articles that aren't about him (which is what the references here are). Bearcat (talk) 17:09, 27 October 2022 (UTC)
 * This is in-depth coverage in a reliable source, Prothom Alo. There is a book on him written by the vice-chancellor of a university in Bangladesh.Vinegarymass911 (talk) 20:47, 27 October 2022 (UTC)

Relisting comment: Relisting as the article has been improved since the time of nomination. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 22:00, 28 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete unless somebody can locate better referencing than has been offered here. Winning a high-level military award is certainly potential grounds for a Wikipedia article, but it isn't "inherently" notable enough to absolve an article of actually having to be supported by WP:GNG-worthy coverage in reliable sources rather than government-published primary source reports. Bearcat (talk) 17:13, 27 October 2022 (UTC)
 * I have expanded the article and the sources. Please take another look at it.Vinegarymass911 (talk) 22:10, 27 October 2022 (UTC)
 *  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * Delete the news Articles not enough in-depth coverage to pass WP:GNG. 🦁 Lionfox 🏹 0909 (talk) 04:46, 29 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep In the EPW article, I find 39 mentions of Ziauddin, including this: " This time the attempt involved a young Bengali officer, Mohammed Ziauddin, who was stationed at the Army's General Headquarters in Rawalpindi. Along with two other Bengalis, they made a daring late night crossing into India via the Sialkot sector of the Pakistan border. The escape of these two men was to have an important impact on the development of the liberation struggle, and the post independence structure of the armed forces. Immediately after independence Taher and Ziauddin would between them command 90 per cent of the' country's infantry. Together they would begin to initiate forms of military organisation unheard of in the subcontinent." Referenced across two pages in Franda's "Bangladesh, the first decade" . The January 2022 piece from the Daily Star is an over-view of Ziauddin's Liberation War record.


 * FWIW, it should be noted that the award he has is effectively the highest gallantry award possible for someone living, the higher award has only been awarded seven times, all during the Liberation War...and requires death in battle. The award he has received has only been issued to 69 people in a country of 150+ million. Passes two elements of WP:ANYBIO: (1) received a well-known and significant award (2) person has made a widely recognized contribution that is part of the enduring historical record in a specific field. Regards,--Goldsztajn (talk) 09:48, 29 October 2022 (UTC)


 * Keep: Per Vinegarymass911 and Goldsztajn —MdsShakil (talk) 16:20, 2 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep: Per Goldsztajn. ≈ MS Sakib  «TalK»  22:47, 3 November 2022 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.