Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Mrs. Globe (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep‎__EXPECTED_UNCONNECTED_PAGE__. This is being closed as a procedural Keep. If the nominator chooses to come back to AFD again with this article, please present a BRIEF nomination rationale focused on policy and not details of the article subject and personalities involved. We are not hashing out the worth of Mrs. Globe just whether or not it has notabiilty to have an article on this project and notability can be from good aspects or bad ones. Liz Read! Talk! 23:21, 13 July 2023 (UTC)

Mrs. Globe
AfDs for this article:


 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

Fails WP:N and WP:NOT (clear promotion or advertising).

The last time this page was nominated for deletion, it was kept only due to insufficient participation, with the primary defendant being the person who created the page (for promotion/advertising as I'll describe below). I'm going to make a strong case that this page be deleted as it is a) not a notable pageant and b) promotional material for a suspiciously profitable non-profit and c) promotional material for the director.

First, this Wikipedia page was originally created by Australianblackbelt, whose account has since been blocked because of WP:NOTHERE as this person attempted to make multiple pages for Mrs. Globe alone and is likely one of the Mrs. Globe staff or a hired PR rep. The page was also edited by early contributors like Dawn Foley and Dolores Couceiro, people who have won aspects of this pageant in the past per the winners list and are listed as staff on https://www.mrsglobe.com/meet-the-staff. Since this page was initially created by Mrs. Globe staff, it was created as promotional content and not because of true notability.

I attended the pageant finale and was disappointed to see a budget, local event that oversells itself in sleuth marketing but is definitely not a large, high-calibre pageant worthy of a Wikipedia page. A recording of the pageant livestream is available here, where the highest attendance was 67 people around the middle. https://vimeo.com/841104953

I can't say for sure how many of us attended in-person, but it was a banquet style audience of tables in a hotel conference room. I would guess 100-200 guests or so.

The pageant appeared to have 66 contestants across 6 divisions:

Mrs. Globe

Mrs. Curve' (size 12 and up)

Mrs. Classique (age 45+)

Mrs. Classique USA

Mrs. USA Globe

Mrs. Canada Globe

Divide 66 contestants among 6 categories and you'll see what I mean when I say this is not a large, high-calibre pageant. In the smallest category, 3 women competed for Mrs. Classique USA, 4 women for Mrs. Canada Globe, 10 for Mrs. USA Globe... etc. Titles were regional nonsense like "Pacific Coast" "West Coast" "Western Provinces" instead of 1 person for every state or province. As well, several of the Mrs. Globe contestants appear to be Americans representing another country just to give the pageant the illusion of legitimacy. Ex. People like Mrs. Venezuela, Rachel Laguna, who was just Mrs. Virginia a couple years ago according to a Google search of her name. Truly a waste of time and money to watch the finale; not the massive, prestigious international pageant like it's marketed to be.

The WIN Foundation appears to be an oversold front. It claims to be a non-profit but something isn't adding up. The website for the WIN Foundation shows that they only do 1 thing: "Reclaiming Me" zoom classes twice weekly for 90 minutes to teach women about narcissistic abuse. There is apparently a $10 charge for each class. And they run a 4-day "discover the divine" conference in Greece that comes at a hefty pricetag of over $1300 too, so clearly impoverished "women in need" can't afford it. Watching the trailer of that conference, it looks like only 12 women attended in 2022 and at least half of them seemed to be established winners of the pageant. Meanwhile the pageant has People's Choice winners bringing in 50k in each division. Even outside the fundraiser awards, I'm sure the pageant brings in big money from the contestants' many fees and from the pageant's many sponsors. This "non-profit" appears to be very profitable considering how much money it's bringing in compared to the expenses of running twice weekly zoom classes. It's a good way to make the pageant be a big virtue-signal that fools people into paying more money to "help charity", while the director of the pageant probably pockets the leftovers to live a luxurious life off of.

Dr. Tracy Kemble (is she a real PhD or is she as much a Dr as Dr. Pepper?) appears to be using this pageant largely as self-promotion, given that her image is everywhere including the front page of the pageant program book. Everything about the pageant seems to be marketing for her low-selling narcissism books and 1 annual "discover the divine" conference. She is nowhere near as popular or informative as Dr. Ramani's YouTube channel on narcissism though. Perusing through Dr. Tracy Kemble's work, she has some low-budget videos with double-digit views providing superficial fluff about manifesting etc. Example: I cannot find any information about Dr. Tracy Kemble's credentials, where she got her PhD, if/where she is licensed to practice, if she sees any clients for therapy, if she does any research, etc. She seems to have one day decided to call herself a PhD when she started up a pageant and nobody ever challenged it. Her main job appears to be this pageant, which is a highly lucrative fake non-profit.

I understand the pageant used to be run in China, but the sparse information available about that period of the past does not confer sufficient notability for a Wikipedia page. As well, a pageant taking place in China doesn't automatically make it notable. If anything, usually holding this pageant in China is another nod to how low-budget it is, because your dollar goes farther in China and it's easier to fill an audience with Chinese guests and hire a slew of Chinese paparazzi to make the event look bigger than it is. There was nothing special about this pageant when I attended as a guest in America. Fixthetyp0 (talk) 21:22, 6 July 2023 (UTC)

I am also nominating the following related pages because they are both apparently just self-promotion, most notable thing about these 2 women is that they won this non-notable pageant and previously won a non-notable national title in the lead-up to this non-notable international pageant:

Fixthetyp0 (talk) 21:33, 6 July 2023 (UTC) Also note this pageant ended 2 weeks ago and the winner was "Mrs. Europe" (not a country, a continent, competing against Mrs. North America and Mrs. Black Sea and other made up non-countries, while also competing against legitimate countries like Mrs. USA and Mrs. Australia). But the point isn't about how the titles are ridiculous. The point is this pageant ended 2 weeks ago and it is so non-notable that nobody has bothered to update the page with the new winner. Every notable pageant I've ever seen, the winner is updated on Wikipedia within the day of the pageant. Fixthetyp0 (talk) 14:45, 7 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Events-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 21:39, 6 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Women, Beauty pageants, Belarus,  and Russia.  Spiderone (Talk to Spider) 22:05, 6 July 2023 (UTC)


 * COI can work both ways i.e. with those creating pages and those seeking their deletion. You say you attended one of the Mrs Globe finals as a guest. You've put down irrelevant information from your own experience to support deleting the article - a kind of original research. The ultra long nomination rationale speaks volumes. I'm putting up a procedural keep !vote as a hold. Rupples (talk) 05:10, 13 July 2023 (UTC)


 * Procedural holding keep. I believe this nomination needs looking into. Rupples (talk) 05:15, 13 July 2023 (UTC)
 * Comment. This nomination is basically a rant. It includes unsubstantiated allegations about a living person and unfounded speculation about the organisation. There would be no place for this "commentary" in a Wikipedia article and it ought not to have been published here. It should be taken down forthwith. Rupples (talk) 07:08, 13 July 2023 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.