Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Nancy Drew: Secrets Can Kill


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. There is no consensus for a block delete of all these articles and significant arguments for keeping. There may possibly be a case for deletion of some individually, but such a consensus is unlikely in a mass nomination and they will need to be nominated again individually. There is some traction for the idea of merging into a list article. That is a matter for editors to discuss outside of AFD as it is a matter for editor discretion, not deletion policy. SpinningSpark 16:32, 5 November 2014 (UTC)

Nancy Drew: Secrets Can Kill

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

Fails WP:N and WP:V: non-notable video game with no references based on reliable, third-party published sources. I've looked for WikiProject Video games approved sources and used our custom Google search, but I'm only finding primary sources and user-submitted review/database material. Woodroar (talk) 07:08, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * I'm also including the following games for the same reason:
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of video game-related deletion discussions.  Woodroar (talk) 07:08, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Video games-related deletion discussions.  Jinkinson   talk to me  08:36, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note that several of these games do have a single review at Adventure Gamers, but we're not able to write an article around a single review. Woodroar (talk) 08:38, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of video game-related deletion discussions.  Woodroar (talk) 07:08, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Video games-related deletion discussions.  Jinkinson   talk to me  08:36, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note that several of these games do have a single review at Adventure Gamers, but we're not able to write an article around a single review. Woodroar (talk) 08:38, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of video game-related deletion discussions.  Woodroar (talk) 07:08, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Video games-related deletion discussions.  Jinkinson   talk to me  08:36, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note that several of these games do have a single review at Adventure Gamers, but we're not able to write an article around a single review. Woodroar (talk) 08:38, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of video game-related deletion discussions.  Woodroar (talk) 07:08, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Video games-related deletion discussions.  Jinkinson   talk to me  08:36, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note that several of these games do have a single review at Adventure Gamers, but we're not able to write an article around a single review. Woodroar (talk) 08:38, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of video game-related deletion discussions.  Woodroar (talk) 07:08, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Video games-related deletion discussions.  Jinkinson   talk to me  08:36, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note that several of these games do have a single review at Adventure Gamers, but we're not able to write an article around a single review. Woodroar (talk) 08:38, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Video games-related deletion discussions.  Jinkinson   talk to me  08:36, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note that several of these games do have a single review at Adventure Gamers, but we're not able to write an article around a single review. Woodroar (talk) 08:38, 12 October 2014 (UTC)


 * Comment: I haven't searched for sourcing yet, but I do think that at this point it'd be a good idea to create a list page for these games and have them all redirect there. The overall Nancy Drew page is pretty large and at this point it'd be reasonable to have a list page for the games as a whole, although most of it would be about the Her Interactive games since those are the majority. I'd recommend something like List of Nancy Drew video games, I think. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tokyogirl79 (talk • contribs) 12:25, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Support Tokyogirl's suggestion. The problem IMO is that individual games may not be notable enough, but all Nancy Drew games in one list could stand well as a split from Nancy Drew the franchise. The infoboxes and/or texts (trimmed to one to two paragraphs) could be reused to suitably provide more information than just a list of names if wanted.  野狼院 ひさし  Hisashi Yarouin 12:47, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment. In Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Nancy Drew: Shadow at the Water's Edge, I located enough sources to fairly conclusively establish notability for that article.  It took a while, but I also fixed up the article.  I was going to edit the others in the series, but when I saw how many there were and how poorly they were written, I gave up.  Unless that video game in the series was a complete anomaly, I think it highly likely that the rest of these articles are also notable.  I guess I can dedicate the entire day to rewriting these articles, but it's not something I look forward to.  I suggest people look at Nancy Drew: Shadow at the Water's Edge and WP:VG/RS to find reliable sources for these articles.  I guess I'll vote to keep later, once I've actually validated that sources exist for these articles.  Given the number of articles nominated, it may take me a while. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 12:50, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * I did some searching and so far it looks like most of the games didn't get any coverage because of how many there are- the whole "law of diminished returns" thing in effect, I guess. I'm going to try to sit down and really do some hardcore searching for the others. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡)   16:38, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Wow. Your Google-Fu—or Highbeam-Fu—is greater than my Google-Fu. I appreciate the additional sources, and agree that a list article would be a good idea. From my initial searches, it seemed like the games in the middle of the series seem to have 7-9 reviews each, and the outliers none at all. Of course, even the games with numerous reviews don't have proper reception sections. Ugh. Woodroar (talk) 18:18, 12 October 2014 (UTC)


 * Merge Nancy Drew: Secrets Can Kill Remastered into Nancy Drew: Secrets Can Kill. I'm going to do this in bits and pieces since there are so many games. I did find enough to show that the first game has enough coverage to show notability, but I don't think that the original and remastered game warrants separate articles. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡)   16:55, 12 October 2014 (UTC)


 * Mostly keep, with the exception of Labyrinth of Lies, which seems to have very little coverage. Also, I guess it would make sense to merge the remastered game into the main article.  I had trouble finding independent sources for that.  Here's what I found:
 * Nancy Drew: Secrets Can Kill (Moby):
 * Nancy Drew: Secrets Can Kill Remastered (Moby):
 * Nancy Drew: Stay Tuned for Danger: (Moby):
 * Nancy Drew: Message in a Haunted Mansion (Moby):
 * Nancy Drew: Treasure in the Royal Tower (Moby):
 * Nancy Drew: The Final Scene (Moby):
 * Nancy Drew: Secret of the Scarlet Hand (Moby):
 * Nancy Drew: Ghost Dogs of Moon Lake (Moby):
 * Nancy Drew: Trail of the Twister (Moby):
 * Nancy Drew: The Captive Curse (Moby):
 * Nancy Drew: Alibi in Ashes (Moby):
 * Nancy Drew: The Silent Spy (no Moby entry):
 * Nancy Drew: The Shattered Medallion (no Moby entry):
 * Nancy Drew: Labyrinth of Lies (no Moby entry):
 * Nancy Drew Dossier: Lights, Camera, Curses (Moby):

These are primarily sources vetted by WP:VG/RS. There are a few other sources that I didn't take the time to actually validate, because, honestly, I think I've done enough work. Of course, MobyGames isn't a reliable source, but it links to many reliable sources. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 18:58, 12 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Software-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 02:17, 13 October 2014 (UTC)


 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Satellizer   (´ ･ ω ･ `)  01:42, 20 October 2014 (UTC)


 * Weak keep or Merge. Argument by NRP and the link to WikiProject Video games/Sources is very helpful. However, creating a list of Nancy Drew games may be a good alternative. They seem to have issues with individual notability, but the franchise as a series is notable enough. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 03:27, 20 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: I've since created the individual page for List of Nancy Drew video games, so any games that are lacking in overall notability can have their information merged into that article. It's a little bare bones now, but I figure that we can all work and put the individual data in there for the various games. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡)   04:10, 20 October 2014 (UTC)

Keep all (except a merge for the remastered games) pet NRP who has demonstrated the notability of every single game. Bad faith AFDs by Woodroar who, it appears, didn't run a simple Google Search. The list by tokyogirl is a valued addition too. :)--Coin945 (talk) 05:46, 21 October 2014 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry you feel that way. All I can say is that I did look for sources, which is why I nominated only half of the games with articles. Although in retrospect, I relied mostly on Metacritic and my memory of WP:VG/RS-vetted general sources and overlooked the fact that genre-specific sources like Adventure Gamers and Just Adventure were on the list as well. (For some reason, I thought they were user-submitted fan sites and didn't dig further.) Consider myself trouted. I'm sorry for wasting everyone's time. Woodroar (talk) 06:17, 21 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Don't worry about it - you helped to bring these poorly written articles to our attention. :D Wikipedia is all about collaboration. Please can you help us to improve each of these Nancy drew video game articles using the sources NRP found in order to make them all awesome.--Coin945 (talk) 06:40, 21 October 2014 (UTC)
 * I was planning on that when the AfD is over but I suppose there's nothing wrong with doing it first. Cheers! Woodroar (talk) 07:01, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

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 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Relisting comment: Several ideas are presented herein; relisting to obtain more input.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, NorthAmerica1000 02:54, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

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 * Keep based on the sources and argument provided by NRP. As for WP:V, a topic only "fails" WP:V if the topic unverifiable which obviously is not the case here.  --Oakshade (talk) 03:09, 28 October 2014 (UTC)
 * Merge and Redirect - The page List of Nancy Drew video games will do a sufficient job of covering these games. Aerospeed (Talk) 15:09, 5 November 2014 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.