Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Nash-Fortenberry UFO sighting


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Barkeep49 (talk) 02:11, 12 January 2021 (UTC)

Nash-Fortenberry UFO sighting

 * – ( View AfD View log )

The current article refers to a non-notable UFO sighting in 1952 attributed to pilots. Attempts to find independent, reliable sources reporting this fringe "event", per WP:FRIND, have failed, with all available sources failing WP:RS, being sensationalist blogs, pro-pseudoscience sites, and so forth. There is both insufficient substance and reliable support to merit an encyclopedia entry. JoJo Anthrax (talk) 14:39, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Virginia-related deletion discussions.  Spiderone  14:46, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Events-related deletion discussions.  Spiderone  14:46, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Paranormal-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 14:46, 8 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Aviation-related deletion discussions. Nash-Fortenberry_UFO_sighting  5Q5 &#124;&#9993; 14:45, 17 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete and merge So many UFO books have included this as filler that it creates an illusion of notability, however the subject is really unknown outside of the UFOlogy bubble. There is one passing mention in an article on the local angle and one including it as a "for instance" passing mention  on the general subject of UFOs. These really don't justify a stand alone article, however I support keeping it (with any mergeable content) at List of reported UFO sightings. - LuckyLouie (talk) 17:49, 8 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Strong keep. At first I was going to agree with LuckyLouie to delete and merge, but then I did a Google search for site:newspapers.com nash fortenberry. This UFO sighting made national news across the United States in 1952. There are plenty of serious mainstream newspaper articles to cite. The article is just waiting for someone to add them. Also, this discussion should be added to Aviation proposed deletes where other UFO articles have been added in the past. There may be pilot editors who want a say.  5Q5 &#124;&#9993; 15:18, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

First officer William B. Nash and second officer William H. Fortenberry had valid sightings of up to 8 coin shaped objects on approach to Norfolk, Virginia. This event involved highly unusual maneuverability, unexplained rapid acceleration and estimated speed conservatively stated at 12,000 mph. Both Nash and Fortenberry were interviewed the next morning by Air Force intelligence officers. Both pilots had served in the Navy and had received intensive instruction in aircraft identification. An effort was made to debunk the sighting, but in the end the Air Force declared the incident unexplained. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Barry Roth (talk • contribs) 22:00, 12 December 2020 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep in support of the excellent search provided above by 5Q5. Certainly notable in its day, and a small part of a larger whole of UFO sightings. Something I think an encyclopedia would benefit from.--Concertmusic (talk) 00:55, 15 December 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America1000 07:00, 16 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete not notable - does not pass WP:GNG outside of fringe sourcing, the only article was a short UP article which was picked up by a number of newspapers on the wire and had no sustained coverage. SportingFlyer  T · C  15:03, 17 December 2020 (UTC)


 * COMMENT: In 1952, the story about this eventual Project Blue Book commercial airline case went out in the United States on two wire services United Press (today's UPI) and International News Service (INS). I counted search results for 47 mainstream U.S. newspapers in my newspapers.com search above, assuming none was a repeat. Outside of UFO publishing, here are examples of sustained coverage presented in or published by mainstream sources over the decades, thus qualifying for notability under WP:GNG.  5Q5 &#124;&#9993; 14:54, 19 December 2020 (UTC)


 * 1968: Statement on Unidentified Flying Objects submitted to the House Committee on Science and Astronautics, July 29, 1968 by physicist James E. McDonald via Princeton University link, pdf
 * 1992: The Indianapolis Star, Indianapolis, Indiana, Monday, September 7, 1992
 * 2014: Sufffolk News-Herald, Virginia, March 19, 2014.
 * 2017: Air & Space magazine, January 2017.
 * 2019: Daily Press, Virginia, August 2, 2019 (Tribune Publishing), founded in 1896.
 * The two wire stories you discuss are almost exactly the same from paper to paper - the only difference is light editing (removal of paragraphs to fit size dimensions). I'm not sure what to make of the statement, which appears self-published. The Indianapolis article discusses the sighting in a single sentence. I cannot find any mention of the sighting in the Air and Space article. I can't access one of the other articles (daily press) and the Suffolk News-Herald is probably fine. I appreciate you providing sources, but I still don't think this is notable enough for an article. SportingFlyer  T · C  19:05, 19 December 2020 (UTC)
 * For some reason the Air & Space article came up in search results and I briefly looked at and thought it was written by the son of the pilot in this case, who is mentioned in the A & S article, but it looks like it's about a different incident so I've struck it out here. I've never edited the Nash-Fortenberry article but if the UFO community doesn't care enough to monitor and fight for such articles, then I'm not going to spend any additional time doing their work. But I will leave my vote as it is and I support editor Luckylouie's position to keep it in the List of reported UFO sightings.  5Q5 &#124;&#9993; 12:52, 20 December 2020 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Sandstein   09:38, 24 December 2020 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Delete per nom. This is another non-notable nonsense. -Roxy the inedible dog . wooF 11:38, 24 December 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep As 5Q5 said, this UFO sighting gained plenty of traction in its day, and was even investigated by the air force and classified as "unexplained". https://documents.theblackvault.com/documents/ufos/AD0688332.pdf https://www.theblackvault.com/casefiles/project-blue-book-unknown-case-files-complete-list/ Pladica (talk) 20:04, 25 December 2020 (AST)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Missvain (talk) 00:43, 1 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom and . There's barely enough outside-the-bubble reporting to warrant a mention in another page, and definitely not enough to support a stand-alone article. XOR&#39;easter (talk) 21:38, 1 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Strong keep per 5Q5. Article very much fits WP:GNG. Some delete votes seem more oriented around the subject being 'nonsense' than whether the article itself is. Vaticidalprophet (talk) 08:30, 8 January 2021 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.