Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Nazir Ahmad (Burewala resident)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   no consensus. Stifle (talk) 00:02, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

Nazir Ahmad (Burewala resident)

 * ( [ delete] ) – (View AfD) (View log)

A reluctant request for deletion on biography of living persons ground. The fact that he confessed to the crime isn't sufficient - some people confess to crimes they didn't commit, and I read in A Mighty Heart that the Pakistani government is willing to "rough up" suspects. While honour killing is a noteworthy phenomenon, and while the killing of four relatives received international media attention, the media attention didn't extend to the outcome of his trial. As such, it looks like the media will never report on whether he was guilty of murder or not. A merge would be suitable if it was only his notability, rather than his guilt, that was in question, but as it is, we probably need to remove him from Wikipedia until he's dead. Andjam (talk) 11:43, 2 October 2008 (UTC) 
 * Keep. Move to Death of Muqadas Bibi as we have done with other articles about killings. -- Eastmain (talk) 17:00, 2 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment That is inappropriate, since three other girls were murdered at the same time. Edison (talk) 18:07, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete.Gsp (talk) 17:54, 2 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Living people-related deletion discussions. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 00:01, 3 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:43, 7 October 2008 (UTC)


 * delete. does not really establish notability. SYSS Mouse (talk) 01:17, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete completely nn and common occurrence in Pakistan.  YellowMonkey  ( click here to choose Australia's next top model ) 07:47, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Pakistan-related deletion discussions.   —Andjam (talk) 12:26, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep on the grounds that the sources are non-trivial and the event in question is notable enough that a song has been written about it by a band notable enough to have a Wikipedia article. However the article must be retitled immediately per WP:BLP because, as noted above, confession is not 100% an indicator of guilt. DAB'ing a living person as a killer who hasn't been found guilty of same in a court of law is extremely hazardous. 23skidoo (talk) 12:27, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm fine with it being renamed during the AFD. Andjam (talk) 12:31, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment It is weird that the article name says "honour" while "honor" is the spelling used exclusively in the article, contrary to WP:ENGVAR. Per WP:BLP it is completely unacceptable to state flatly that he killed 4 daughters, when there is no reference stating that he was found guilty. Even then, it is would be more encyclopedic to state that someone was convicted of a crime than that they committed the crime. Google News archive shows stories in the "western" press only from December 24-25 of 2005, with no followup. Someone with access to and able to read the Pakistan press might be able to confirm followup. There is no evidence that it is common for a man in that country to kill his four daughters, as it asserted above, even if there are reportedly over 200 honor killings a year in Pakistan. If a man killed four daughters who were from the U.S. or the U.K., it would be an article with more refs and edits than Laci Peterson or Disappearance of Madeleine McCann. Undecided pending followup as to subsequent press coverage which did not jump from Pakistan's papers to the AP. Edison (talk) 18:05, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Crime-related deletion discussions.   -- • Gene93k (talk) 20:15, 7 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep as sufficiently notable, though we do need some followup. I do not see a BLP violation in this particular  context. .DGG (talk) 03:15, 8 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Weak Keep assuming pakistani sources exist, and this is not a simple one-off news story. But rename is essential - what if he didn't do it? Claiming the husband of the victim was abusive without sources is also a gross BLP violotion.Yobmod (talk) 09:41, 9 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Note I've renamed the article. Andjam (talk) 11:20, 9 October 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.