Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/New Brunswick Curling Association (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. The arguments for retention (i.e. the inclusion of sources which can establish notability) outweigh the reasons for deletion. Moreover, the rough consensus is clearly on the retention side. –MuZemike 15:30, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

New Brunswick Curling Association
AfDs for this article: 
 * – ( View AfD View log )

fails WP:ORG. 70 years of existenceyields only 12 articles in gnews and most of it is not indepth. very little meaningful content in article LibStar (talk) 07:54, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Keep. Nominator fails to establish how it is not notable. Google news is not a measure of notability. -- Earl Andrew - talk 12:25, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I've not found significant coverage to meet WP:ORG. You have failed to demonstrate how this article meets WP:ORG or evidence of significant coverage. WP:JUSTAVOTE. LibStar (talk) 12:30, 10 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Delete. No third-party coverage found. Nothing that makes this curling club provincial governing body any more notable than any other. --Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars (talk) 19:09, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
 * This is not a curling club, it's a provincial governing body for the sport of curling in the province of New Brunswick. -- Earl Andrew - talk 22:01, 10 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Canada-related deletion discussions.  — • Gene93k (talk) 17:32, 11 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions.  — • Gene93k (talk) 17:32, 11 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sports-related deletion discussions.  — • Gene93k (talk) 17:33, 11 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Keep - Agree fully with Earl Andrew.--BabbaQ (talk) 18:54, 11 May 2011 (UTC)
 * WP:JUSTAVOTE. Zero attempt is made to show how this subject meets WP:ORG. LibStar (talk) 22:35, 11 May 2011 (UTC)
 * As a provincial governing body for the sport of curling, there are probably lots of secondary sources to ensure this is covered by WP:ORG. I'm interested to know if the nominator has any familiarity with the sport in Canada, because I'm thinking he doesn't. -- Earl Andrew - talk 01:26, 12 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Keep - There are plenty of third-party sources that either reference, describe, or are members of the New Brunswick Curling Association, as required by WP:ORG. It meets the WP:ORG criteria for a non-commercial organization. It is a non-profit organization that hosts or sanctions activities that are national in scope, and those activities are verifiable by reliable sources, like curling results webpages, curling club pages or the curling association page itself, which contains a plethora of information on the association. There should be no problem if the NBCA is not mentioned in many Google News articles but is mentioned in an adequate amount of third-party sources which confirm the activities of this organization. Prayerfortheworld (talk) 01:33, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
 * "There are plenty of third-party sources " please provide evidence. LibStar (talk) 01:56, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Here is a list of sources that reference, mention, acknowledge, describe, etc. the NBCA. (not exhaustive)


 * Hopefully these are satisfactory. Prayerfortheworld (talk) 02:22, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
 * almost all of these sources are not independent of the subject. you need third party sources like mainstream media/newspapers, not simply websites of other curling clubs/organisations. LibStar (talk) 03:05, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Nothing in WP:ORG says they have to be independent of the subject. Why would a source mention the NBCA if it wasn't on the subject of curling? Why would any source mention an organization if it wasn't on the topic of what that organization does? You are really grasping at straws, for what appears to be some anti-curling stance of some sort. -- Earl Andrew - talk 12:33, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
 * see the overview in WP:RS. Wikipedia is quite clear that third party sources should be used for demonstrating notability. You and others are grasping at straws for notability and have failed to demonstrate existence of reliable sources. This has nothing to do with anti-curling stance I nominate a wide variety of topics for deletion every week. LibStar (talk) 15:07, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Anyone seeking to keep this article should create inline citations on the article, not just in this discussion, especially any showing national or international curling events or participation in events. --DThomsen8 (talk) 12:51, 17 May 2011 (UTC)

Keep: Google might only give twelve hits. A search of ProQuest's Canadian Newsstand database reveals 312 results. A few of the more notable ones are listed below (citations abbreviated to save time and space, but have been filtered to remove trivial mentions): There are more, but I believe these cover the notability issue. Provincial coverage, but it covers a number of years, events, etc. There are more, if need be. Canada Hky (talk) 18:33, 12 May 2011 (UTC)
 * "N.B. curling loses one of its great contributors; Tribute: Forsythe remembered as grassroots volunteer who pitched in where needed" Kevin Barrett. Telegraph-Journal. Saint John, N.B.: Mar 12, 2010.   pg. B.7 (About a former president)
 * "Bathurst Curling Club still going strong, despite tax debt" Katherine Hunt. Telegraph-Journal. Saint John, N.B.: Apr 11, 2011.  pg. A.5 (About association's efforts to maintain curling clubs in the province)
 * "'Semi-official' Moncton will host 2009 men's world curling championship" Sean Hatchard. Telegraph-Journal. Saint John, N.B.: Sep 1, 2007.  pg. C.8 (Association's efforts to get an international event)
 * "NBer named national curling president; Elections Al Forsythe of Moncton is the new president and Beth Sullivan of Bathurst fills vice-president's post" Andrew Mcgilligan. Telegraph-Journal. Saint John, N.B.: Jun 19, 2007.  pg. B.8 (Personnel changes)
 * "Curling body should re-examine how it determines women's champion" Dave MacLean In the house. New Brunswick Telegraph Journal. Saint John, N.B.: Jan 12, 2007.  pg. B.7 (Pretty much exactly what the title says)
 * "President leaves post with game enjoying progress; Ron Hutton has been a loyal servant to curling" DAVE MacLEAN. Telegraph-Journal. Saint John, N.B.: Apr 8, 2005.
 * the coverage is all in New Brunswick. see comment below. LibStar (talk) 05:13, 14 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Comment this organisation clearly fails WP:CLUB. The scope of their activities is national or international in scale. LibStar (talk) 05:13, 14 May 2011 (UTC)
 * The NBCA is not a club, it's an organization. -- Earl Andrew - talk 14:27, 14 May 2011 (UTC)
 * WP:CLUB is specifically for non commercial organizations such as NBCA. Not just for clubs. LibStar (talk) 14:40, 14 May 2011 (UTC)
 * The NBCA's activities involve hosting national and international events. The NBCA played a role in hosting, among other events, the 2009 Ford World Men's Curling Championship, which is an event that is international in scale. It also hosted various Canadian men's and women's national championships. The scope of those events are national. Prayerfortheworld (talk) 23:22, 15 May 2011 (UTC)
 * and where is the national coverage for this? LibStar (talk) 23:49, 15 May 2011 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.