Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Noon clan


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Consensus is that there is no evidence they are a clan, and if they are there is no evidence that they are notable. Sarahj2107 (talk) 21:23, 5 June 2018 (UTC)

Noon clan

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Barely any content, and the fact remains that the article only contains one source. I think that this article would fall under WP:GNG, a Wikipedia rule regarding content and sources in an article. EggRoll97 11:03, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Pakistan-related deletion discussions.  MT Train Talk 11:20, 29 May 2018 (UTC)


 * Comment Perhaps someone from Pakistan could try to find more sources. Gianvito Scaringi (talk) 15:10, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Keep Clearly this is an exceptionally prominent family in Pakistan. FloridaArmy (talk) 17:45, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * If so, could you please add references to the clan prominence (and not to that of the individuals)? Thanks, Gianvito Scaringi (talk) 18:09, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * This source discusses the "clan" and searching "Noon family" Pakistan turns up others on Google Books. FloridaArmy (talk) 18:21, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Where does the linked source discuss them as a clan, as opposed to people bearing the name? I can only see snippet view. Of course, Noon is also a name found elsewhere in the world, used by people who definitely have nothing to do with a clan of Pakistan, as also is the spelling Noone. - Sitush (talk) 18:27, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Page 112. This source is also referred to as discussing the clan (not sure if it uses the word clan or family, haven't read it). FloridaArmy (talk) 18:33, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks. But is it discussing them as a clan or just using clan as a passing mention in the informal sense (group of people etc)? I found the snippet for the page you gave and, as is common with snippets, I have no context for the use of the word. - Sitush (talk) 18:44, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Full text of Noon from that article: For example, it took a Noon on the PPP ticket to defeat the "official" Noon-Tiwana clan candidate in a Sargodha seat. So it does say "Noon-Tiwana clan", FWIW. But, does a mere passing mention, that too combined with another name, satisfy GNG?--regentspark (comment) 22:40, 29 May 2018 (UTC)


 * Comment this article has a chequered history, eg: Noon family and Noon (Pashtun tribe). At worst, it could be a set-index of people bearing the name Noon. However, associating those people with an alleged clan/tribe can be dodgy unless they have self-identified (see User:Sitush/Common for some background to this). - Sitush (talk) 18:05, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Comment. The only thing I could find was a link to a disallowed site, which doesn't seem to match what's in the article. Deb (talk) 20:06, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Keep I found 4 links on a major Pakistani English-language newspaper Dawn. I am chipping in to do my share, expanded the article with 5 new references. Will try to do more tomorrow, made it a stub article so we can expand it further. Ngrewal1 (talk) 21:11, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Most of what you have added so far just says certain people bear the name. The sources are not discussing the clan as a clan. - Sitush (talk) 22:07, 29 May 2018 (UTC)


 * Delete "Clan" is a stretch., merely assert that there is a family with the last name Noon. asserts that there exists a person with a last name Noon.  asserts that there are two people with Noon as a last name. So that leaves us with a few people called Noon and that doesn't constitute a clan, notable or otherwise. --regentspark (comment) 22:35, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Actually 3 says "He had carried on the Noon family’s political legacy with great integrity. He was former prime minister Feroz Khan Noon’s cousin. He retired from active politics in the late 1970s while introducing his son Malik Amjad Ali Noon into the field." And your 4 says "Malik Amjad Ali Noon and his father Malik Anwer Ali Noon mostly live in their hometown village Ali Pur Noon. The Noon family has 27 villages in Tehsil [Bhalwal]: Nurpur Noon, Sultan Pur Noon and Sardar Pur Noon, among others. Malik Feroz Khan Noon ex-Prime Minister of Pakistan was also a prominent member of the Noon family." I hadn't seen those sources so they are in addition to those noted above. FloridaArmy (talk) 23:30, 29 May 2018 (UTC)
 * The fact remains that all we have is a few people with the name "Noon". That doesn't create a prominent clan. The few prominent people can be included in the disambiguation page Noon_(disambiguation). You need to show that the clan is notable (and that it is actually a "clan" whatever that means). For example, is Noon a subcaste or a tribe? The mere existence of a few people, prominent or not, with a last name is not sufficient. --regentspark (comment) 23:38, 29 May 2018 (UTC)


 * Delete-Transforming family into a clan/tribe/caste is clearly into territory of WP:OR and WP:SYNTH. ~ Winged Blades Godric 03:09, 30 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Comment Actually the Noon clan of families and landowners are spread all over Pakistani Punjab province as FloridaArmy mentioned above after reading the sourced material and according to my sourced material that I had used to edit and improve the article on 29 May 2018. How do you know 'Noons' are just a few people? When they live and are spread all over the province of Punjab, Pakistan in the thousands, they certainly make a clan. User talk:Winged Blades of Godric went ahead and removed all my references and content from this improved article on 30 May 2018 and added a unreferenced template on top of the article. I prefer not to engage in an edit war with you, Winged Blades, but to be fair and balanced, I would like the closing administrator to see and read my edited article from 29 May 2018 before he/she makes their decision about this article. So I am asking you to please restore my 4 references from Dawn (newspaper) and content. Ngrewal1 (talk) 20:18, 31 May 2018 (UTC)


 * Comment Another thought of mine is that...there are several large villages named after Noon clan with articles already on Wikipedia ...Alipur Noon, Sultan Pur Noon and some villages without Wiki articles like Nurpur Noon and Sardar Pur Noon in different areas of Pakistani Punjab province - see this GoogleBooks link. In my view, after reading the sourced materials, the large extended Noon clan's history goes back to the 19th century settlements (several large villages in different areas of Punjab). Over at least a period of a century, they have grown in numbers and have formed a Noon clan. Ngrewal1 (talk) 00:15, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Um. That would be original research. Unless you can find a source that says that the many villages joined together to form a clan. --regentspark (comment) 00:20, 4 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete as WP:SYN. Guy (Help!) 10:21, 30 May 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete - The "Noon-Tiwana" faction of which Malik Feroz Khan Noon was a member may be encyclopedic, but the Noon clan as a family group seems to fail NOTINDISCRIMINATORY and NOR/SYNTH. If the article were about the Noon-Tiwana group, I might !vote rename/merge/redirect. Smmurphy(Talk) 13:42, 30 May 2018 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.