Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Norman Hsu (disambiguation)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was withdrawn.. tedder (talk) 07:21, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Norman Hsu (disambiguation)

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unnecessary page, already a hatnote on only article on a Norman Hsu to only article mentioning another Norman Hsu. I prodded this and it was removed because the editor felt that Hsu was better known for the school board than the controversy and that Hsu is not mentioned in controversy article. This isn't the case - Nornam N. Hsu is not mentioned on school board link, and is mentioned on controversy link (try searching for Mr Hsu rather than Norman Hsu). Boleyn3 (talk) 05:34, 20 August 2009 (UTC) Comment It doesn't meet dab guidelines - MOS:DABRL, which is the threshold for disambiguation pages. If you think he's notable, consider creating an article. Boleyn3 (talk) 17:53, 20 August 2009 (UTC) Comment Hsu is not mentioned on the school board article. I am also not arguing for no disambiguation - only that disambiguation can be better served. At the moment, someone would type in Norman Hsu if they wanted Norman N. Hsu, end up at the wrong article, then click on the dab link, then go to a dab with a selection of blue links connected to Hsu, including two he isn't mentioned on. My proposal is that they type in Norman Hsu and see a direct link at the top of this page to the only article which mentions Hsu. Boleyn3 (talk) 18:52, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep There was significant confusion at the time of Norman Hsu's notoriety in August 2008 - i.e two politically connected individuals that shared the same name, with the school board member being unfairly mistaken for the Ponzi scheme artist. Also, the threshold for disambiguation pages is lower than for articles. Ronnotel (talk) 12:10, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep And the confusion has not ended. Norman N. Hsu is a Republican and ran for CA state assembly primary in 1998. You can't compare an article of an entity with that of an event. Norman N. Hsu is obviously listed on the school district website. And both persons will continue to appear in the news. HkCaGu (talk) 18:46, 20 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I'm afraid you've got me completely lost. Can you please be more specific regarding your desired page layout. The potential pages are: NYYH (Norman Y. Y. Hsu), NNH (Norman N. Hsu), School (the school board page) and DAB (disambiguation page). To which exact page will the search term "Norman Hsu" link to and how will the casual reader be instructed regarding the difference between the two individuals? I'm not saying you don't have a valid proposal, but I'd like to understand it. Ronnotel (talk) 20:22, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

CommentThe search term Norman Hsu already goes straight to the only article on a person of that name, who you are referring to as Norman Y. Y. Hsu. At the top of Norman Hsu was a hatnote to Norman Hsu (disambiguation), so if someone realised that the Norman Hsu they'd arrived at wasn't the one they were looking for, they'd click on the hatnote link and go to the disambiguation page. They'd then read it through, perhaps click on two links in Norman N. Hsu's entry which don't mention him - very frustrating - and then click on the third one which does. A very long way round to finding the only information on WP about him. I changed the hatnote from linking to the dab, to linking directly to the one article which mentions Norman N. Hsu. This would mean if someone types in Norman Hsu and relaises it's the wrong one, there is a clearly worded hatnote which will take them directly to the only article that mentions him, instead of all round Wikipedia. Boleyn3 (talk) 05:54, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
 * OK, I think I understand what you are suggesting but I hardly think it would help distinguish NYYH from NNH. The mention of NNH in the Ted Sioeng link is misleading and suffers from the same confusion between the two I identified above. The sentence is confusing and seemingly suggest that NNH contributed to HRC in 2007, which is not supported by the sources. The text in the DAB page is much clearer about the difference between NYYH and NNH. Ronnotel (talk) 12:36, 21 August 2009 (UTC)

Withdraw nomination simply because this is dragging on and wasting people's time. I've created an article on Norman N. Hsu - those who know about him may well want to edit this as it is currently very much a stub. I've tidied up the dab so it means the guidelines - 1 blue link per line on dabs (and that blue link should actually mention the entry) and shortened it, as for further info people should look to the article. If anyone feels that the two Hsus still may easily be confused, please adjust the wording, but without much increasing the sentence fragment for each entry - it shouldn't really be more than a line, as beyond that, people should click for the article. Boleyn3 (talk) 12:27, 6 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Tentative Keep, without prejudice to early renom. With due respect for Boleyn's concerns, i think AfD is likely to be an unsuitable place for hashing out a Dab problem, which is what seems to be in progress. (And there is a question, since Dab's are aggressively stated not to be articles, whether this is the place to do it. That is not just a technicality: the issues weighed on AfD recur over and over, but they are completely different from Dab issues, and how many frequent AfD discussants have seriously studied both MoSDab and MoS? It's not surprising that the arguments are hard to follow here!) IMO it would be more appropriate to work out the Dab issues, at WT:Disambiguation if necessary, and if we end up with a useless or harmful Rdr (after an appropriate merge), take that to WP:RfD. --Jerzy•t 08:19, 22 August 2009 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.