Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/North Circular Road, Dublin


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. —  Aitias  // discussion 14:01, 25 December 2008 (UTC)

North Circular Road, Dublin

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Non-notable road Balloholic (talk) 00:03, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep - I’m sorry to disagree here but it seems that notability of the street has even been noted here state-side as shown by-New York Times -Roanoke Times -The Observer  - New York Times (again ).  Than of course there is The Telegrapher .  Not counting the numerous results from Google Scholar as shown here,.  So I hope you understand my reasoning for the Keep opinion.  Thanks. ShoesssS Talk 00:54, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I am studying each source dilligently and will respond as required. A couple of things I have noticed. Mentions of Ulysses in the NYT are not notable enough in their own right and should go here as standard. The second source is from something I have never heard of and even though I approached it with an open mind and was highly amused at some of its language, it can be dismissed purely because it notes the road is a busy thoroughfare - in the middle of a load of other lanes, avenues and alleyways that I'm sure would delight even the most uninterested American tourist. Wikipedia is not a shopping directory, nor is it a guidebook for tourists - it is an encyclopedia. --Balloholic (talk) 01:48, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * The Observer - Gerry Adams making a trip here is not particularly notable. He along with numerous other politicians can be seen on the streets of Dublin and the rest of Ireland when campaigning for election. I'm sure it is the same in every other country. Gerry is particularly renowned for doing this in his attempts to win votes. I imagine the idea of someone with as decorated a past as Gerry Adams roaming hungrily through a busy city street in broad daylight is very novel stateside but here it is all too normal. Bertie Ahern broke his leg prowling through Dublin recently. If it had happened on this street I would not consider it notable. --Balloholic (talk) 01:55, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * The (so-called) "Telegrapher" provides us with this amusing anecdote drenched in grammatical errors (i.e. the road itself not in capitals, the use of garda in an incorrect context): "a middle aged man and woman walking backwards and forwards across the north circular road watched by scores of Garda, some of them on horseback, and filmed by a police camera set up on a large crane parked in the middle of the road." I find it extremely insulting and cannot see how this could be worked into an encyclopedic article.
 * The Ancient New York Times article seeks to tell the tale of a Presbyterian who got into trouble with the law. Again nothing particularly historic, just a general piece of news that you might even find in today's edition.
 * To sum up. The number of sources is not everything. They have to say something useful. --Balloholic (talk) 02:06, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * :Comment - Ah, I see your point. The articles referenced do not meet your standards.  When they talk about the road, it is either to placate the easily amused American tourist, or Gerry Adams stopping by, as I am sure he has stopped by every lane - street - road - highway in all of Ireland, or an article that you have found grammatical errors in and let us not forget the Ancient New York Times, which talks about a Presbyterian getting in trouble with the law, which between you and me the Presbyterians always seem to be in trouble with the law.  How about the Google Scholar results, nothing in the 130+ books referenced there?  You couldn’t find anything in one of the references showing  that “…North Circular Road is one of the main transport corridors” or  the “great tradition of the Pevsner architecture” is not listed?  ShoesssS Talk 03:29, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Incidental mentions in articles discussing other things don't satisfy Wikipedia's standards. A newspaper article documenting demonstrations outside of a sports fixture, for example, that says nothing at all about this road, is not a source for this article, and certainly doesn't satisfy the Primary Notability Criterion. But an entry on pages 205–206 of ISBN 9780300109238, documenting what legislation caused the North Circular to be built, the Earl of Aldborough's miscalculation in building xyr townhouse on the road, and the slow pace of development over the 18th and 19th centuries, shows at least one published work that has covered this subject in depth. Picking a grab-bag of news articles that simply have the phrase "north circular road" somewhere in them, and then being sarcastic to editors that quite rightly point out that they aren't sources, because they don't actually document the subject at hand, is not a very effective rationale for keeping.  Do what I did, and look for proper, actual, sources.  &#9786; Uncle G (talk) 04:58, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep - This does appear to be one of the main arteries in Dublin and per the multiple sources found above.--Oakshade (talk) 06:05, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep per rationale cited by Oakshade and Shoessss. Cbl62 (talk) 06:51, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment - Since we're going to have a trivial article like this, I suggest we mention its inclusion in the Irish edition of monopoly (really the Dublin edition in disguise) as well. Might I also point out that if we went by google maps and the roads they've highlighted we'd have at least 50,000 roads for Dublin alone and at least 10 for every nook and cranny in Ireland. Which would be fine but would we have anything interesting or notable (I use the two words interchangeably, not because I'm interested but because anything notable is interesting to me in that it improves Wikipedia)? No. I think not. Can anyone find anything interesting about such a highlighted road in Ennis or Athy? Google maps is used to indicate which are important roads but how are they important but to a few drivers who get lost and need directions? --Balloholic (talk) 22:17, 22 December 2008 (UTC)
 * That would be more suitable for mention in the entry on Monopoly. Autarch (talk) 15:47, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Exactly. But we're having a trivial article so it really should be included here as well just to complete the farce. --Balloholic (talk) 16:37, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * This road is a major thoroughfare on the north side of Dublin, with several buildings mentioned in it. Autarch (talk) 17:15, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Being near Croke Park hardly makes it notable. How near is near? If we go that far we might as well say it is near Japan. --Balloholic (talk) 17:25, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Two of them - namely the Mater Hospital and Mountjoy Prison are on the road, as stated in the article. Autarch (talk) 17:36, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Lots of streets have been deleted for having more notable buildings. The buildings are notable and have their own articles. COMMONSENSE. That is more than enough. If we want the phone numbers of the buildings we get a phone book. We don't need a business directory here. We're trying to run an encyclopedia. At least I think we are. Sometimes I think it is all a lie. --Balloholic (talk) 17:41, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Ireland-related deletion discussions.   -- • Gene93k (talk) 01:28, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Transportation-related deletion discussions.   -- • Gene93k (talk) 01:28, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep actually notable street, thanks to Joyce. Quite sufficient sourcing. DGG (talk) 12:22, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Where? Cure my blindness. "Man writes about large road in novel!" Sensational stuff. --Balloholic (talk) 16:08, 23 December 2008 (UTC)
 * See User:Themfromspace's comment at Articles for deletion/Newbridge Avenue. Sums up the fact that it getting mentioned in a novel shouldn't make it notable for a one-line article on an encyclopedia. Try Joycepedia - or set it up if it doesn't exist. --Balloholic (talk) 14:09, 24 December 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep as per everyone but nominator. Clearly notable. Edward321 (talk) 00:14, 25 December 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.