Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Odinia International


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Yunshui 雲 水 07:48, 2 August 2019 (UTC)

Odinia International

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A website that is mentioned briefly in one Vice article. All other references are to the site itself, private blogs or web tools like Alexa. Couldn't find any other reliable sources. Doesn't seem to meet WP:GNG. Ffranc (talk) 07:48, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Politics-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 07:57, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of United States of America-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 07:57, 19 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Websites-related deletion discussions.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 08:09, 19 July 2019 (UTC)


 * The targeting of this organization, its website, and its founder has recently become the subject of a congressional inquiry involving the FCC. It does not fall into the category of not being notable by any means. Another notable point is that the editor of this website it not a Neo Nazi and is an Oxford educated scholar. I have confirmed her credentials and have determined that this organization has no political affiliation and is not a neo Nazi organization. I have tried to edit this article and make it factual once or twice but my edits were deleted replaced with libel. I would not mind trying to make this into an unbiased and accurate article, since, after all, that is the stated goal of this online encyclopedia. User User talk :Wotanswarriors  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wotanswarriors (talk • contribs) 00:14, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
 * If you can do this with sources that fit WP:RS and which focus on Odinia International (not just mention it briefly) that would be excellent. If your sources are of the same kind as those currently in the article (blogs, database entries etc), then it's better to delete the article. Ffranc (talk) 08:48, 21 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Here is the section in the article in Vice, ''"One of the nation’s most notorious alt-right reconstructionist Pagans, Seana Fenner, explained to me that, “A few years ago, there wasn’t as much interest or knowledge about Odinism or Asatru.” In 2006, McNallen estimated that Asatruars or Odinists numbered between 10,000 to 20,000 in the United States. But along with the rise of Donald Trump and emboldened racists across the nation, Fenner claimed to me that her brand of racial Paganism is “becoming wildly popular.” White supremacist Asatruars and Odinists are especially thriving in US prisons. Fenner identifies as an Odinist. She also believes that the Holocaust was a lie and has an entire page on her website dedicated to “white genocide” where she claims, “It is only white nations that are being targeted for genocide by immigration.” In an especially chilling post on Memorial Day in 2017, she wrote of hoping to avenge all those soldiers who had died for “Jewish wars.” Fenner also told me that she believes that non-white people cannot participate in Heathenry or Odinism because that would “[make the] religion into a joke.” The 74-year-old is the founder of Odinia International, a group with more than 5,000 followers on Facebook that advocates for the restoration of “native European religion.” Fenner sees Christianity as a violent, foreign, Jewish religion that was forced onto European peoples. On the other hand, “Odinism is the final stage of deprogramming,” she told me. And it helped her enhance her “tribal identity.” Her main goal as an Odinist leader today is to “restore the native religion [of Europeans]” and she believes “white nationalism, or white identity, is central to” that mission. To Fenner, the reason her task of converting Christians and “eclectic” Paganists to racist Odinism has gotten easier is simple: “It’s something people are drawn to because they wish to have this connection to their ancestors and their own native spirituality.” She finds there are two kinds of people drawn to her faith: those who “want to practice [their] own religion as part of [their] identity,” and those who feel they are being “marginalized and blamed for things they didn’t do.” The latter reason embodies the myth of reverse racism against whites that has helped fuel the rise of the alt-right in general. This concept of “white genocide” has had a similar impact internationally in terms of mobilizing and energizing racists. On November 11, 2017, more than 60,000 white nationalists marched in the streets of Poland, rallying around this notion of a “Pure Poland, white Poland!” and demanding that the “Refugees get out!” For Fenner, this was a “wonderful” development she’d love to see happen in the US. “The only thing that would have been better would be if the Poles had bodily removed the non-Europeans from their nation, and sent the antifa protesters to a black nation in Africa where they could get all the diversity they need. But perhaps that will come.” Fenner and her extremist group Odinia International are not isolated bad apples. Instead, they stand alongside ill-famed names like Stephen McNallen and his Asatru Folk Assembly, Jack Donovan and The Wolves of Vinland, and countless others who intertwine hate with Paganism. This hate has been trickling down, infecting Pagan communities across the nation, which has been especially disconcerting for practitioners of colour."
 * Merge Fenner's name and a couple of sentences about this FRINGE group to Heathenry (new religious movement). The Vice source is solid, but it is the only WP:RS we have on this vile ORG.E.M.Gregory (talk) 21:53, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
 * There's only really one sentence in that quote about Odinia International. There is more about the founder and her views, but not the website. The Heathenry article is FA rated and already has substantial coverage with better sources. I don't see how it would be improved by anything from this article. Ffranc (talk) 11:40, 28 July 2019 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America1000 03:53, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
 * This is demonstrably not a fringe movement. Its founder has far better, more relevant credentials than any other Neo-Pagan group's leader I know of, its membership is apparently in every US state, as well as the U.K., and rapidly growing, and there are other sources, particularly radio shows, such as Red Ice, which cover it. In addition to this, the founder of this group has done substantial scholarly work in regard to the restoration of native European religion in the form of a series of documentaries. Encyclopedias are meant to be unbiased so I would like to make changes which present accurate facts and all view points rather than obvious defamation of character, if no one minds particularly! — Preceding unsigned comment added by Wotanswarriors (talk • contribs)
 * Delete We still have only 1 source. and it's on the founder of this tiny, fringe cult, not the cult itself.  which does make it a delete.  If anyone finds WP:SIGCOV, feel free too ping me to reconsider.  But teh sourcing we have at this point does not cut the mustard.E.M.Gregory (talk) 11:46, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete Per E.M.Gregory, the sourcing isn't substantial enough to establish that Odinia passes notability standards. Best, GPL93 (talk) 04:12, 29 July 2019 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.