Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Olympic Airways Flight 411


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Per additional sourcing added since nomination meeting WP:V and GNG. (commonly known around here as HEY) 78.26  (spin me / revolutions) 14:10, 16 October 2020 (UTC)

Olympic Airways Flight 411

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Not notable incident. The article isn't referenced and Aviation Safety Network doesn't have an entry for it. Is it a hoax? ...William, is the complaint department really on the roof? 22:21, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Events-related deletion discussions. ...William, is the complaint department really on the roof? 22:21, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Transportation-related deletion discussions. ...William, is the complaint department really on the roof? 22:21, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Aviation-related deletion discussions. ...William, is the complaint department really on the roof? 22:21, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Greece-related deletion discussions. ...William, is the complaint department really on the roof? 22:21, 23 September 2020 (UTC)


 * Delete nothing notable, and may actually be a WP:HOAX. I cannot find RS. If this article is a hoax we could use a G1. Lightburst (talk) 23:31, 23 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep Found WP:SIGCOV when using Greek search terms:  TV show (Μία στις χίλιες (1994) the source in the article Jumpytoo Talk 01:00, 24 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment A few more Greek sources covering the story to be found if search is done by using the captain's name, Σήφης Μιγάδης. ǁ ǁǁ ǁ Chalk19 (talk) 10:26, 24 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep I found some other sources when I searched for it in English, so the incident clearly not a hoax. Also, because it continues to appear in a variety of recent sources like the ones that Jumpytoo provided, the article also meets WP:DIVERSE and WP:PERSISTENCE. Scorpions13256 (talk) 04:21, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Delete I am trying to understand why we would keep this article We are WP:NOTNEWS, this event does not pass WP:GEOSCOPE and WP:LASTING with anything more than a mention. Because it was not a hoax does not make it notable by default. I see no significance in terms of aviation history. Wm335td (talk) 19:03, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure if I agree with you that this article does not meet WP:GEOSCOPE. The guideline states that if an event has had a significant impact over a wide region, domain, or widespread social group, it may be notable enough for inclusion. The fact that this event seems to be covered regularly at the national level in Greece makes it seem like it has had a long-term significant impact over there. I also fail to see how this article violates WP:NOTNEWS. I'm pretty sure that WP:NOTNEWS only applies to breaking news, original reporting, single events, and routune reporting. Again, the fact that this event has repeatedly received significant coverage over the years makes it seem like WP:NOTNEWS doesn't apply. Scorpions13256 (talk) 19:16, 7 October 2020 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Delete have to be consistent with notability for aircraft incidents where there is no loss nor harm to human life. WP:ROTM aircraft incident. -- Whiteguru (talk) 13:10, 26 September 2020 (UTC)
 * An aircraft incident is notable only if there is great loss of human life ? What about an exceptional case (like this is supposed to be according to the Greek sources) that the captain faced a very dangerous situation and calmly managed to save the lives of the passengers, and perhaps of even more people, those of the residents of the city area that the plane would have otherwise chashed ? ǁ ǁǁ ǁ Chalk19 (talk) 13:35, 26 September 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Sandstein   14:52, 1 October 2020 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep If an almost-crash of a 747 which narrowly avoided a great loss of life is "run of the mill", I never want to be anywhere near the airlines the previous !voter flies. The statement that loss or harm to life is a necessary factor for notability is not sustained anywhere in our policies and is contradicted by articles such as British Airways Flight 9, KLM Flight 867, Eastern Air Lines Flight 855, Gimli Glider, and possibly the most famous airliner gliding incident, US Airways Flight 1549 a/k/a the "Miracle on the Hudson".  Searching for "Σήφης Μιγάδης Ολυμπιακη" (i.e., "Sifis Migadis Olympic" in Greek) brings up a large number of significant, independent, reliable sources that easily meet WP:GNG Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 19:30, 8 October 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Sandstein   11:11, 9 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment, I've updated the article and I would like to submit it for Heymann Standard consideration. There are enough sources to show that this was definitely not a hoax article. I would have liked to expand it even more, but the Hellenic Air Accident Investigation and Aviation Safety Board website is offline currently.  Aviation Safety Network's database is not completely comprehensive and a WP:BEFORE in Greek shows more than enough sources to demonstrate significant coverage in independent reliable sources. Pinging . Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 20:49, 9 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep Per user's Eggishorn reasoning of October 8th. ǁ ǁǁ ǁ Chalk19 (talk) 15:07, 12 October 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep - article has improved since nomination. Seems a significant incident. Lack of deaths ≠ lack of notability. Mjroots (talk) 18:44, 14 October 2020 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.