Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Owain Phyfe


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep (Non-admin closure) --Regards, MrScorch6200 (talk · contribs)  17:47, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

Owain Phyfe

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does not meet WP:NMUSIC or WP:GNG. Fundamentally no more than a local niche act. John from Idegon (talk) 20:15, 7 February 2014 (UTC)


 * Keep! This gentleman was a staple fixture at renaissance faires across the country as well as touring with Ritchie Blackmore, a well-known rock musician, and being a recording artist played across a variety of formats. None of this qualifies him as a "local niche act", by any stretch or reasonable standard whatsoever. By this complainant's reasoning, any independent musician who identifies with a specific genre should also be considered for deletion. Good luck with that. - Scarletminx — Preceding unsigned comment added by Scarletminx (talk • contribs) 01:40, 9 February 2014 (UTC)
 * KEEP The ignorance of John from Idegon does not make this man local or niche. He is icon of modern folk, medieval, and Renaissance music exercising tremendous influence throughout the US and the World. Even though he gets regular play on many radio stations, he has deliberately chosen to go his own route rather than that of the commercial pop scene. "In contrast to modern society's anti-individual influences, such as manufactured stardom and fluffy, insubstantial music, Phyfe's choice to record on his own independent label reflects his interest in maintaining integrity in his art while focusing on individuality." http://www.renaissancemagazine.com/backissues/owain.html Someone with more time than I should properly add this citation to his Article, Thank you. Maghnuis 21:41, 8 February 2014 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Maghnuis (talk • contribs)

KEEP! Owain played throughout the country and had a large following due to it. Modern Renaissance Music is no more niche than many other forms of music. He was not a local garage band playing bars for drinks. He was a well known artist in his genre with several recorded albums to his name. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dancingotter72 (talk • contribs) 11:20, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * I am not sure how many niche acts have their music used in Wim Wenders movies. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1440266/soundtrack?ref_=tt_trv_snd Jejones3141 (talk) 15:09, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * KEEP. IMO, the media coverage alone supports the subject's notability. He has performed way too widely to simply be called a "local niche act". Rosencomet (talk) 22:05, 7 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment, could you be more specific? I don't see any media on him from reliable sources excepting the story in the local paper cited in the article. John from Idegon (talk) 22:38, 7 February 2014 (UTC)
 * There are 2 magazine reviews of Phyfe, one TV review, and seven album reviews listed in the article. They exist whether there are links supplied or not. This is aside from the inline citations.Rosencomet (talk) 23:09, 7 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Again, could you be more specific? One of the core policies of Wikipedia is verifiability. John from Idegon (talk) 23:10, 7 February 2014 (UTC)
 * "Period Music for Modern Times", Renaissance Magazine, v.3 no.4, pp.50-53. (That would put it in 1999, I believe.) Owain Phyfe and the New World Renaissance Band did for medieval and Renaissance music what Steeleye Span and Fairport Convention did for English and Scottish folk music, i.e. make it accessible to modern audiences, and did so at Renaissance fairs, where a quite astonishing amount of the music heard comes from centuries after the Renaissance. Jejones3141 (talk) 14:56, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment WP:NOTMEMORIAL also applies. John from Idegon (talk) 00:06, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment I don't see how. The article was created more than four years before the death of the subject.Rosencomet (talk) 00:36, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * User:kennyfiddler Keep! Owain Phyfe was not simply a local niche act. He performed at renaissance faires and festivsl events from Maryland to Los Angeles, and had a somewhat rabid following. (I wish I had a following like that...) While he may be seen as simply a performing musician, he was a keeper of the Welsh Bardic tradition in a very real sense. To get a feel for how Phyfe affected his fans, see this page: https://www.facebook.com/groups/314018545360069/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:306:BCE1:50B0:7CEB:3A62:5FE3:A087 (talk) 03:03, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Keep. The reviews are posted on the page, most of his albums can be found listed on the Modern Bard website . Seeing as he performed coast to coast              , I'm not certain how he is considered a "local" act. I think that the Renaissance Magazine article fairly well establishes his place as a major entertainer in the genre. However, since citations are wanted? 7 of his albums are available for sale at Exodus books , 5 are available through CD Universe , and there are over 30 tracks on itunes . So...the albums exist. The articles mentioned by Rosencomet appear to be linked through from the page itself. As for their being no media from reliable sources? Renaissance Magazine (available at major bookstores including Barnes & Noble) has written about him twice. The first article is available online through their site . " Please note that the failure to meet any of these criteria does not mean an article must be deleted"/"Has become one of the most prominent representatives of a notable style"/"Has been the subject of multiple, non-trivial, published works appearing in sources that are reliable, not self-published, and are independent from the musician or ensemble itself." All of the preceding points from the notability requirements come into play here. Twice appeared in Renaissance Magazine, one of the most prominent representatives of the Ren Faire music scene (as also noted in the Renaissance Magazine articles, and there is absolutely no reason to delete this article. Ceronomus (talk) 03:34, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * KEEP - He played nationally, not locally. Playing Renaissance music is no more "niche" than playing jazz or classical.  Touring with Ritchie Blackmore is not to be sneezed at, and his facility in multiple languages and presence on at least one movie soundtrack also raises him above the average.  Not to mention the awards he has won and the international exposure.  If the tone of the article is too "memorial" that can certainly be remedied by less drastic methods than deletion. Bookgrrl holler/ lookee here  04:15, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Keep - Owain was a wonderful musician who worked at Renaissance festivals all over the country. I first encountered him at the Tennessee Renaissance Festival in 1999 and fell in love with his music.  Every opportunity I had to go back to that faire, I always looked for him.  It was my pleasure to come across him several years later at the North Carolina Renaissance Faire in Raliegh, NC, as well as at the Maryland Renaissance Festival.  Unless you wish to consider the entire country as local, it is incorrect to consider him nothing more than a local act.  Owain's music has been used in multiple episodes of The Renaissance Festival Podcast.  His music is even available to listen to on the Pandora Internet Radio site, although to find his music you have to search for New World Renaissance Band.  He has been in multiple issues of Renaissance Magazine, including being featured on the cover of Issue #10.  The article from that issue was titled Period Music for Modern Times.  An article entitled "In Memory of Owain Phyfe" was included in Issue #88, but the article is not available online.--Lorenalis (talk) 05:17, 8 February 2014 (UTC)


 * Keep. Our notability guideline for music, Notability (music), it says that for musicians who are "outside mass media traditions" that they be "frequently covered in publications devoted to a notable sub-culture". Owain Phyfe was frequently covered in the sub-cultures of the Renaissance Faire and early music. He was on the cover of Renaissance magazine, and his music was reviewed many times in periodicals associated with early music and the Renaissance Faire: Tudor Times, Magical Blend, Rambles, Greenman Reviews, DaBelly and Revue magazine which is for crossover classical music. He was a record company owner and founder, a small label focusing on the RenFaire crowd. Furthermore, he toured North America and Europe with Ritchie Blackmore and Candice Night, touring as "Blackmore's Night with special guest Owain Phyfe". Blackmore's Night played a lot of Ren Faires and they took Phyfe to Germany. Phyfe played at the wedding of Blackmore and Night in 2008. This biography definitely should be kept. Binksternet (talk) 16:29, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Phyfe has one film music credit for the Wim Wenders film Pina as seen at Allmusic and IMDb. He performs in the straight-to-video film  The Lost Princess (2005). These little bits add incrementally to notability. Binksternet (talk) 20:04, 8 February 2014 (UTC)

Other coverage: the New World Renaissance Band's album Where Beauty Moves and Wit Delights was Number Five on the 1994 Top Ten List of Jurgen Gothe's DiscDrive program on CBC Radio 2 (out of Vancouver, which is rather distant from Detroit for a "local niche act" to be known.

"(Disc No. 5) The New World Renaissance Band-Where Beauty Moves and Wit Delights

“A sparkling ensemble (from Texas and Michigan) making ancient music spring to life—by keeping the instruments in tune and maintaining a sense of humor. No museum pieces here, despite the fact they are all ‘ancient songs of love and adventure.’ Owain Phyfe leads with voice and a wire-strung instrument called the chitarra battente. There is clarity, charm and excellent production—fine packaging for the disc, too. If you feel that much of early music is the domain of the academics, let these latter-day troubadors entertain your next dinner party with vitality and joy.”

—Jurgen Gothe" Jejones3141 (talk) 19:02, 8 February 2014 (UTC)


 * Speedy Keep per above. Ridiculous to bring to an AfD. Pete Tillman (talk) 17:45, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

Please KEEP Owain Phyfe. He is a very important musician in a very large culture of the Renaissance Faire go-ers and is very important. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.29.204.228 (talk) 23:57, 9 February 2014 (UTC)

Note also that Owain Phyfe and Sasha Raykov performed at the 2002 Bloomington Early Music Festival (http://www.blemf.org/index.html). Photos can be found at http://www.kevinatkins.org/blemf2002/. (The Nightwatch Recording site has the text of a review of the performance; alas, one must be a paying subscriber to the Bloomington Herald Times to see the text on their web site, though anyone can search for it and find that they do have it.) This festival is the only one of its kind in the Midwestern United States, and collaborates with faculty and students in the Early Music Institute of Indiana University. Anyone familiar with the early music movement will know of Indiana University's relevance to it, and a look at the vitae of performers who have played at the Festival would show, I think, that they would not select a "local niche act" to perform there. 174.30.85.99 (talk) 12:53, 10 February 2014 (UTC)


 * COMMENT Isn't it time to close this nomination? Ten "Keeps" and not a single "Delete".Rosencomet (talk) 16:38, 12 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Comment, there is really only one of the "Keep" votes that proffers a valid argument for keeping, and that is the one from , but his argument is compelling enough to prompt me to withdraw my nomination. Please see the instructions for commenting at an AfD discussion. This isn't a poll where people can say they like an article.  You have to provide valid arguments based in policy and on reliable sources.  Binksternet's is the only !vote to do that. John from Idegon (talk) 20:09, 12 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Thank you, John. That kind of re-assessment of your initial position shows your depth and objectivity. Binksternet (talk) 22:19, 12 February 2014 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.