Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Patrick Bouvier Kennedy (5th nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Diasagreement whether this is a case of purely inherited (non-)notability or whether his place in medical history makes him notable.  Sandstein  15:51, 13 July 2015 (UTC)

Patrick Bouvier Kennedy
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I know I'm going to catch flak for this because the article is about a Kennedy, but... I have to go with WP:INHERITED and WP:1E. His notability lies solely on his parents and he is known for just one thing: being stillborn to his famous parents. Those two factors do cause this article to fail WP:GNG. -- WV ● ✉ ✓ 04:55, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep. Sources clearly indicate notability. And it seems inappropriate to nominate this article yet again. Everyking (talk) 05:15, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep - agree with Everyking. His short life/sad death had lasting impact. —Мандичка YO 😜 07:39, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. North America1000 08:35, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of United States of America-related deletion discussions. North America1000 08:35, 5 July 2015 (UTC)


 * Delete as per User:Winkelvi reasoning — Preceding unsigned comment added by Givenunion (talk • contribs) 12:11, 5 July 2015‎ (UTC)
 * Delete per WP:BIO1E and per WP:NOTNEWS, which states "Even when an event is notable, individuals involved in it may not be. Unless news coverage of an individual goes beyond the context of a single event, our coverage of that individual should be limited to the article about that event, in proportion to their importance to the overall topic." Patrick isn't noted for anything on his own beyond dying within two days of birth, and notability is not inherited; being a Kennedy does not by itself make someone notable. Snuggums (talk / edits) 14:21, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep. If he had indeed been stillborn this might be a different debate, but he was not - as this source and many others (eg. ) his premature livebirth and subsequent death "inspired aggressive research into the cause and treatment of RDS and served as a catalyst in the development of regionalized neonatal intensive care". His appearance in medical literature continues to this day, and indicates a significance beyond simply who his parents were. Nikkimaria (talk) 14:39, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * That doesn't really make him exempt from WP:BIO1E since that is all based on one event Snuggums (talk / <b style="color:#454545">edits</b>) 15:00, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Two events: widely covered birth, widely covered subsequent death. But even if we wish to interpret this as a single event, it would still be appropriate to keep this article, per the guidance regarding a "person famous for only one event [who] may be more widely known than the event itself" in BIO1E. We have multiple sources detailing this individual's short life and the impact of his death, more than enough to pass GNG. Nikkimaria (talk) 16:40, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * WP:NOTNEWS says "Even when an event is notable, individuals involved in it may not be." <b style="color:#454545">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#454545">talk</b> / <b style="color:#454545">edits</b>) 16:49, 5 July 2015 (UTC)


 * Keep. The subject was written of not merely on the occasion of his birth and death, but continues to be written about fifty years later in the New York Times.   This will be the fifth time we've resolved here that the subject is notable by WIkipedia standards.  Wikipedia would in no way be improved by the removal of this article.- Nunh-huh 15:30, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * See WP:NOTNEWS; merely being written about in papers doesn't necessarily indicate notability, however much time has passed. <b style="color:#454545">Snuggums</b> (<b style="color:#454545">talk</b> / <b style="color:#454545">edits</b>) 16:21, 5 July 2015 (UTC)
 * NOTNEWS is not news to anyone. We are all well aware of it. Everyking (talk) 01:03, 6 July 2015 (UTC)
 * That's an assumption you shouldn't make. You have no idea who will wander into this discussion nor do you know what their understanding of policy will be.  Your chastisement is out of order and unwarranted, .  -- <span style="text-shadow: 4px 4px 15px #0099FF, -4px -4px 15px #99FF00;">WV ● <span style="text-shadow: 4px 4px 15px #FF9900, -4px -4px 15px #FF0099;">✉ ✓  01:28, 6 July 2015 (UTC)


 * Delete This is a person who lived all of two days. America is not a monarchy, and the children of presidents are not default notable. Especially those who lived under a week.John Pack Lambert (talk) 05:31, 10 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep - this has been discussed over and over again. Consensus can change but at this point we are beating a dead horse. Bearian (talk) 20:47, 10 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Per, I'd also agree to the effect that he was an index case for neonatal illnesses. Bearian (talk) 21:07, 10 July 2015 (UTC)


 * Keep - When you're used in medical research as an index case Gaëtan Dugas i think there's a case for notability. These one event guidelines should have a proclaimer saying "doesn't apply to everything" because this is one of those cases. I am on the other side of the world so i am far from patriotic or something either. There's also TWO events the birth and then subsequent death, you "might" say not every (the) individual is notable in a birth and a death but then we would have to rename the article into Patrick Kennedy's life as that is the event. We don't have Arabella Kennedy as that was one event aka stillborn. GuzzyG (talk) 00:27, 12 July 2015 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.