Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Pietro Maximoff (Marvel Cinematic Universe)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was redirect to Quicksilver (Marvel Comics). There is consensus that at this time a separate article is not warranted, and that the character should be covered in existing articles. How to implement that and whether to merge any content from this article is up to interested editors.  Sandstein  10:50, 29 November 2021 (UTC)

Pietro Maximoff (Marvel Cinematic Universe)

 * – ( View AfD View log )

InfiniteNexus thinks that this does not meet WP:MCUCHARACTERS, so I am sending the article to AfD on behalf of him. GeoffreyT2000 (talk) 00:14, 25 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Fictional elements-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 00:39, 25 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Film-related deletion discussions. Robert McClenon (talk) 02:23, 25 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of United States of America-related deletion discussions. Robert McClenon (talk) 02:23, 25 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment - I accepted this article from draft space via AFC, because it was my opinion that it satisfied notability and verifiability. I was not aware of the Marvel Cinematic Universe characters guideline, but will note that it is only a local consensus and does not have the status of a special notability guideline.  I am not !voting at this time.  Robert McClenon (talk) 02:31, 25 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Speedy Keep This is a proxy nomination which is not policy-based; there is no WP:DEL-REASON and so no case to answer. See also WP:BEFORE and WP:NOTCLEANUP. Andrew🐉(talk) 08:49, 25 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment - I respectfully disagree with User:Andrew Davidson. This is not a Speedy Keep 1, because it does state a policy-based reason, which is that the article does not comply with the guideline on Marvel Cinematic Universe characters.  Whether that is an adequate policy-based reason can be discussed.  This looks like a valid AFD to me.  Robert McClenon (talk) 16:29, 25 October 2021 (UTC)
 * WP:MCUCHARACTERS says explicitly that "This page is not one of Wikipedia's policies or guidelines, as it has not been thoroughly vetted by the community." So, there's no policy-based reason. Andrew🐉(talk) 00:21, 26 October 2021 (UTC)
 * User:Andrew Davidson - You are misinterpreting Speedy Keep 1. It doesn't say that failure to advance a policy-based reason is a basis for a Speedy Keep.  It says that failure to advance a reason for deletion is a basis for a Speedy Keep under certain circumstances.  It also says:  "Also be aware that the speedy keep criteria, particularly the first three, are not to be used to express strong disapproval of the nomination: a rationale that you don't agree with is still an argument for deletion, is not necessarily vexatious, and does not imply the nominator has neglected to read the page."  You are saying I don't like it.  A closer will recognize that your argument is a valid Keep but not a Speedy Keep.  ("I don't like deletion" is also not a valid argument.)  Robert McClenon (talk) 19:36, 30 October 2021 (UTC)


 * Draftify as the subject of the article only has had one major appearance so far (excluding two minor cameos), so any information regarding him can be found at and . InfiniteNexus (talk) 23:35, 25 October 2021 (UTC)
 * No valid deletion rationale under Wikipedia's deletion policy is advanced by the nominator, so either the nominator should withdraw the AfD nomination, or another uninvolved editor should speedy keep or close the discussion on procedural grounds. WP:MCUCHARACTERS is not a guideline or essay, a mere Wikiproject shorthand for local consensus which may be consistently evolving. Draftifying the article is pointless if the issue is not WP:TOOSOON; a redirect and merge back to Characters of the Marvel Cinematic Universe would be the appropriate option, if there is realistic prospect for the character/topic to meet the presumption for a standalone article due to WP:GNG concerns. In any event, this should have been the focus of discussion in the Wikiproject's talk page, which is already underway at Talk:Pietro Maximoff (Marvel Cinematic Universe) at the time this faulty AfD was nominated. Let the Wikiproject decide whether there should be a standalone article. Haleth (talk) 14:06, 26 October 2021 (UTC)
 * What do you mean by ? The taskforce has already established a clear guideline specifying the local consensus on standalone character articles. Additionally, this topic has been the focus of numerous discussions, including here (an article that was actually rejected by himself), here, here, here, and has also been brough up here. There is clear consensus among the taskforce. InfiniteNexus (talk) 15:33, 26 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Again requesting input from . InfiniteNexus (talk) 15:34, 26 October 2021 (UTC)


 * If it's up to the task force, then we already know what the outcome is: to draftify. This character is nowhere near the threshold—which is significant appearances in at least four projects or being a protagonist—having only two significant appearances in Age of Ultron and WandaVision. are you saying that this should be procedurally closed as speedy keep and then just draftified without the need of an AfD if the task force considers it? —El Millo (talk) 15:49, 26 October 2021 (UTC)
 * InfiniteNexus, I wouldn't know about the volume of discussions since I am not part of the MCU Wikiproject and I don't edit in the MCU topic area at this point in time. Again, this reinforces my belief that this article should not have been nominated for AfD in the first place, since the Wikiproject's members appear to be perfectly capable of deciding a clear consensus among themselves if there is a need to negotiate a merge of the article back into the main list of MCU characters. Not to mention the fact that there is already an active talk page discussion about whether the article should have been spun out. PS: I am not sure if you should be pinging other editors, even if you are doing it in good faith, since there are strict rules about canvassing in AfD's.


 * El Millo, yes I am saying this should be procedurally closed as speedy keep, but the ongoing discussion on the talk page should continue. As Robert McClenon have pointed out, it is counterproductive to sending it back to draftspace when the process of taking it out of draftspace was already complicated. If there is already a clear consensus from the project that Pietro Maximoff (Marvel Cinematic Universe) should not exist in mainspace, merging and redirecting to the main list means that its article contents would still be preserved in its article history and as part of a list entry, which would prove useful in the odd chance that a standalone article can be entertained if more coverage about this version of the character do emerge in the future. Articles in draftspace are not hosted indefinitely and will be deleted after 6 months unless their primary authors regularly updates and improves them. So the MCU Wikiproject should determine the finality of this topic, and draftiying it does not accomplish that finality. Haleth (talk) 16:02, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

style="background:gold">BD2412 ]] T 17:43, 26 October 2021 (UTC)
 *  Draftify and restore redirect to Characters of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. The MCU-specific iteration of this character does not yet merit a separate article. [[User:BD2412| Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Sandstein   08:59, 7 November 2021 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Relisting comment: A lot of different views and no clear 'best' one in terms of policy. Giving this one more relist to see if further input can lead to a consensus. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Daniel (talk) 00:37, 20 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Draftify Per . — ChannelSpider (talk) 18:36, 27 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Merge to Quicksilver (Marvel Comics). I don't find arguments for splitting up such entities convincing. One page per fictional character should suffice. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 08:45, 28 October 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep. The article has enough reliably sourced material to meet WP:GNG, including out of universe material like production/reception that isn't on the MCU characters list or on the page for the comic book version. Such material would lead to disproportionately large entries on those pages. While WP:MCUCHARACTERS suggests four non-cameo appearances, I would note that it's not a policy/guideline, and that the unique nature of the casting for Pietro/"Pietro" in Wandavision generated a large amount of coverage by reliable sources that other MCU roles with similar screen time would not have received. Patar knight - chat/contributions 19:35, 5 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Draftify: As the initial creator of this draft, by copying relevant content from Peter Maximoff, and as an MCU task force member, I don't think this article is up to standards of notability just yet. There appears to be too much of a pairing with information relevant to Evan Peters' character in WandaVision, Ralph Bohner, as to the relationships and events. Those aren't relevant to what this character has gone through and what is with this character, as Bohner and Pietro are not the same, even remotely. Some commentary on the casting trick and impersonator should be discussed, but it shouldn't be a near 1/3 of the article's subject. The "Appearances" section seems it could use some more work, as does the opening to the article. The third background paragraph could probably be cut back to only focus on this character. It'd be safe to move it back to the draftspace so these issues can be civily discussed on the article's talk page, rather than trying to determine this complicated article's fate here and at the task force. Trailblazer101 (talk) 02:44, 7 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Merge and condense to add to Quicksilver (Marvel Comics), and add a link to that Marvel Comics article in . The content of the article seems decent, but I would agree with the guideline given in WP:MCUCHARACTERS for four non-cameo appearances if that is the conensus by the taskforce. Cautilus (talk) 13:34, 12 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Merge as compromise per Cautilus. There is already a lot of overlap with the main topic and the verifiable aspects can be summarized there. There's a consensus that this doesn't meet the WP:GNG due to a lack of sources. Shooterwalker (talk) 18:07, 26 November 2021 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.