Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Prince Oscar of Prussia (born 1959)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. I'm not convinced either way at this point. Please note, AfD is not a place for clean up. If there is a BLP violation please handle it through PROD or speedy.

Thanks everyone for participating. Unhappy with this decision? If one wishes to renominate this article with another policy-based rationale, they are able to do so. Happy holidays. Missvain (talk) 17:38, 22 December 2021 (UTC)

Prince Oscar of Prussia (born 1959)

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)
 * Prince Oscar of Prussia (born 1959)
 * Oskar Prinz von Preußen

No references for a BLP article Signed,Pichemist (Talk) 17:03, 29 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. Signed,Pichemist (Talk) 17:03, 29 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Germany-related deletion discussions. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 18:46, 29 November 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment. The two works listed under "Further reading" in the article appear to be partly about Prince Oscar and may be enough to establish notability. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 18:50, 29 November 2021 (UTC) Searching for the German form of his name may yield better results such as https://www.lvz.de/Region/Altenburg/Prinz-von-Preussen-besucht-Altenburger-Kinderhaus and https://www.lvz.de/Region/Altenburg/Prinz-von-Preussen-besucht-am-Dienstag-Altenburger-Johanniter and https://www.haz.de/Hannover/Aus-der-Stadt/Uebersicht/Johanniter-feiern-60.-Geburtstag This reference (Erbstößer, Elizza. Oskar Prinz von Preußen: Kaisersohn, Soldat und Johanniter. E. Erbstößer, 2010.) appears to be to a different person. The German version of the article says that he was awarded a decoration by the Hungarian government, but I don't know how important it is. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 19:10, 29 November 2021 (UTC)
 * I believe it is the Order of Merit of the Kingdom of Hungary, which looks like a notable award to me. --Kbabej (talk) 20:49, 29 November 2021 (UTC)
 * As with similar orders in other countries, such as the Order of the British Empire and the Légion d'honneur, whether membership grants notability depends completely on what level the membership is. It's not the order that matters, but the rank. Phil Bridger (talk) 18:19, 7 December 2021 (UTC)


 * Keep. There's coverage in the newspaper Leipziger Volkszeitung about his visits to the city (refs here and here); and coverage of leading the 900-year-old Bailiwick of Brandenburg of the Chivalric Order of Saint John of the Hospital at Jerusalemin in Der Tagesspiegel (ref here). Combining the press coverage with the fact he is leading a historic organization, I think it's reasonable to keep this subject. --Kbabej (talk) 20:43, 29 November 2021 (UTC)


 * I don't understand why the discussion corelates to WP:GNG when the prime reason for WP:XFD is cause of the lack of references for a WP:BLP article. Signed,Pichemist (Talk) 16:47, 13 December 2021 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Extraordinary Writ  (talk)  19:22, 6 December 2021 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Relisting comment: JoelleJay's argument still hasn't been responded to or addressed. Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Daniel (talk) 06:20, 14 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep per Kbabej. Could use some touching up, though.  ~Junedude433 (talk)  04:36, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Royalty and nobility-related deletion discussions.  Spiderone (Talk to Spider) 18:51, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete. Neither LVZ article provides encyclopedic SIGCOV of the subject, and the first is just a refactored press release from Johanniter ("Johanniter announced this in a press release"). The second (which seems to be in the subsublocal section of "Altenburg/Volunteer work and royals") is giving a play-by-play of his visit/the event (the bulk of it is trivial details like "His Royal Highness has to record a reminder video with his smartphone"), complete with literal dialogue between him and a coordinator (my favorite is "“Anyone who plays samba cannot be a Nazi,” he says simply.") It's neither substantial coverage of him nor encyclopedic material in the first place. The Der Tagesspiegel piece is an interview of him, so cannot be used for notability considerations since it is not independent secondary coverage. JoelleJay (talk) 22:25, 8 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep. Enough sources to satisfy WP:GNG. -- Necrothesp (talk) 11:01, 9 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Which ones are "enough to satisfy GNG"? How are the LVZ articles remotely substantial coverage of him? JoelleJay (talk) 04:30, 10 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep agree as Kbabej said above, there is enough to meet WP:GNG. I've deleted many deposed monarchy crufts but this one is different. Thanks VocalIndia (talk) 10:01, 12 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Like I asked of Necrothesp, which sources indicate he meets GNG? What encyclopedic, biographical information can be extracted from the second LVZ article? Attending a super-local non-notable event tied to his own organization is decidedly not Wikipedia-worthy material. And the DT article is an interview, which has long been considered unacceptable for meeting GNG because it is primary and not independent commentary on the subject. JoelleJay (talk) 03:50, 13 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep per Kbabej. Looking at the articles the prince is the reason for the news coverage, if he wasn't notable the media wouldn't report on him. Had a quick look and also covered in Braunschweiger Zeitung, Die Welt . Passes GNG but agree with other comments that the article needs improvement. - dwc lr (talk) 11:55, 21 December 2021 (UTC)
 * if he wasn't notable the media wouldn't report on him. Except the mere fact that someone "gets reported on" is not one of our notability criteria, and moreover, the media doesn't report on him with any degree of depth. Can you please explain how the LVZ(*) articles above, the un-bylined BZ blurb announcing Dr. Oskar Prince of Prussia spoke to readers about the Johanniter, the nobility in the 21st century and their great family role model and giving a bare-bones "bio", or the Die Welt announcement that has all of this to say about him: Oskar Prince of Prussia will succeed ex-Federal Foreign Minister Hans-Dietrich Genscher, who died in the spring of 2016. The 59-year-old is Lord Master of the Order of St. John, as the festival organizers announced on Wednesday in Gardelegen. contain significant coverage? A handful of news reports providing the same routine biographical details and nothing else is neither evidence of SIGCOV nor of BASIC.
 * (*)I should note that my earlier description of the longer LVZ article is really generous in how much coverage he receives. The only sentences that even obliquely mention him are: How is any of that encyclopedic? JoelleJay (talk) 19:48, 21 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete Fails to meet GNG due to insufficient coverage in independent sources, as JoelleJay, with characteristic diligence, has shown. The reports only show trivial details with no evidence of notability. Avilich (talk) 20:58, 21 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep The media coverage may be slight, but it isn't nonexistent; and the subject will be of note to anyone interested in European royalty and dynastic families. Ficaia (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 15:43, 22 December 2021 (UTC)
 * Try familiarizing yourself with WP:SIGCOV. Avilich (talk) 16:05, 22 December 2021 (UTC)
 * I guess it all depends how you define "significant coverage". There are the two articles mentioned above about the subject's connection with the Order of St John, the oldest chivalric order in Europe. There is also this article about his media career.[1]. The subject belongs to an ancient dynastic family and holds an historic office. I don't think these are "trivial details". I think the information is significant and the 3 articles mentioned should be enough to save this article. Ficaia (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 16:59, 22 December 2021 (UTC)
 * The real problem of JoelleJay is WP:IDONTLIKE, imv. VocalIndia (talk) 17:37, 22 December 2021 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.