Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Promises of troop withdrawal by American presidents


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.  

The result of the debate was delete. NSLE ( T + C + CVU ) 04:01, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Promises of troop withdraw by American presidents throughout history

 * Terrible POV fork of US Presidents, nothing more than an attack add really--Petral 01:34, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * also there are now two of them (both of which will be covered by this AfD): Promises.... and Campaign...., both seperate articles with cloned content--Petral 02:48, 23 December 2005 (UTC)

Additonal point, since the origional author decided to clone his article, keep voters should probably specify which of the two clones they want to keep, as obviously one of the duplicates would be removed either way--Petral 03:49, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Comment: Delete voters should probably know that page now called Promises of troop withdrawal by American presidents. Nominator seems to have set up wikipedia account just prior to making AfD nomination . Page protection (following edit war between nom and page creator) would seem to prevent any improvement to article during AfD process. -- JJay 12:14, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete as blatant POV fork. -- Antaeus Feldspar 02:09, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, listcruft of bits of information taken out of context, /very/ prone to edit wars and POV. Pavel Vozenilek 02:13, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * I don't need to be a weatherman to see where the wind is blowing. I will delete the article myself. Travb 02:19, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * comment something isn't adding up here, at some point you moved the article somewhere else and cloned it's content, back into the origional article space, now I can't find where you moved the origional to--Petral 02:36, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * found it hiding in plain site, you faked the redirect--Petral 02:39, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * you are accusing me of something I am not doing--you make a lot of accusations, and add nothing to this article Petral. After You said yourself that "user is showing some restraint and is now cooperating with the AfD process". I added a link originally to the new name.  I just created this article.Travb 02:54, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Petral, you cannot put an article on Afd then decide to skip the process and delete it yourself. In fact, unless you are a sockpuppet, you cannot delete it at all. Wait for the Afd process to complete. This is contentious behaviour on your part. Why not go have a nice cup of tea and allow the Afd to complete normally? KillerChihuahua?!? 03:49, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * um, what? mistaken identity?--Petral 03:55, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Trying to read too many posts too close together, my apologies. I saw the "I will delete the article myself." by Travb, above, followed by your comment. For some reason I registered you (Petral) as the one who said that. Let me try this again:
 * Travb, You cannot create an article which is placed on Afd then decide to skip the process and delete it yourself. In fact, unless you are a sockpuppet, you cannot delete it at all. Wait for the Afd process to complete. This is contentious behaviour on your part. Why not go have a nice cup of tea and allow the Afd to complete normally?
 * Again, apologies for the mistaken identity. KillerChihuahua?!? 04:03, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Adding note: As Travb did create the article, there is a speedy cat for that if that is what Travb desires. KillerChihuahua?!? 04:06, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Have you ever been involved in something that you really enjoy, a book, a movie, a warm bath. etc. And some rude idiot comes along and ruins it.  I was smack dab in the middle of creating this article, minding my own business when Petral came along and ruined my "warm bath".  I was going along, enjoying myself in a certain train of thought, and then all the sudden I get interupted, I get pulled out of the bath, thrown outside, and beat by some stranger.  That may be historonics, but that is how I feel.  I got to the point, I just wanted to throw up my hands and delete the damn article. I started a new article, and Petral and Petral's friends (maybe sockpuppers of Petral) all put that article up for deletion too.Travb 04:13, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia is not your warm bath and you will be thanked to assume good faith and not throw groundless accusations of sockpuppetry. -- Antaeus Feldspar 17:40, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Not so sure it's groundless. Travb is hardly the first, or second, or third person to note the possibility.  Jim62sch 22:22, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * "The possibility can be imagined" is not the same thing as "there are grounds for a public accusation." Would you like to specify exactly which of the many people agreeing with Petral, some of whom have more years on Wikipedia than he has days, are purported to be his sockpuppets?  When actual evidence surfaces that any particular user is a sockpuppet, present that evidence.  Presenting the suspicion as you are now, with no evidence beyond "I can't comprehend why people think my article should be deleted", is only evidence that you are violating WP:AGF. -- Antaeus Feldspar 00:26, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete- POV fork. Reyk 02:51, 23 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Keep. Seems like the topic is worthy of inclusion. -- JJay 03:29, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Comment: Considering that the nom joined wikipedia today, I would be interested to know how he/she found this article and mastered the AfD process? -- JJay 03:58, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Comment: S-P?


 * Delete --HappyCamper 03:30, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep per JJay. KillerChihuahua?!? 03:43, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, POV fork. User:Zoe|(talk) 04:22, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep, article is not POV, and listing promises of troop withdrawl is factual. The article is worthy of inclusion.--Bkwillwm 05:10, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, POV fork. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 05:38, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Merge contents with Election_promise Endomion 05:44, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete strong POV potential, hard to properly cite with accuracy, inherently a trouble page.--MONGO 06:08, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * As long as you're here, could you impose a short ban on travb, just from editing these AfDs, he seems intent on disrupting these votes--Petral 06:32, 23 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Strong delete inherently POV. --King of All the Franks 06:13, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Emphatic delete - articles are POV by "cherry picking" on the examples and the facts. Secondly, titles were misspelled. Page has been the subject of an edit war in which both parties violated 3RR. B.Wind 06:26, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Strong Delete. What's next, World Leaders Who Were Morons Just Like Dubya? Flyboy Will 09:22, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Im sure there have been promises by American presidents of troop withdrawals which have been upheld. This article deliberately sets out to only present the incidents where they havent and so is POV by only telling one side of the story. And with only two examples, it can hardly be said to have happened "throughout history". -- Astrokey44 |talk 11:57, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete Material on this page ought to appear on the pages of the presidents who made these promises --Pierremenard
 * Delete POV fork. Durova 16:21, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Unencyclopedic topic. Wonder if it the article will be unprotected first or deleted first? --Andylkl [ talk! 16:48, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. I can't think of any circumstances in which this list would become a useful resource, and at the very least it is representative of an anti-institutional POV. ALC Washington 17:31, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete - lists are inherently useless as they are never going to get ALL such promises EVER made by American Presidents listed on the article, and therefore the article will ALWAYS be inaccurate Cynical 20:15, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete --NaconKantari 20:16, 23 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete as a POV fork. Crotalus horridus (TALK ● CONTRIBS) 02:42, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete pov and unencyclopedic Paul 18:11, 24 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete troopwithdrawalcruft.  Grue   21:20, 25 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Weak delete POV fork. Stifle 13:01, 26 December 2005 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.