Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Pumpkin tomato


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. -- RoySmith (talk) 00:11, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

Pumpkin tomato

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

PROD'd by me yesterday, de-PROD'd by creator shortly after.

Original PROD reasoning: I just cannot find any indication that these are even a thing, let alone a notable thing. I tried searching "pumpkin" in the referenced book but it doesn't use the word to refer to a tomato variety. Google has lots of noise from recipes that use pumpkin and tomato, but even adding +Peru, +variety, or +cultivar didn't produce anything (even trivial hits).

De-PROD edit summary was: People today think everything is recorded neatly online and if Google doesn't show you the answer in the first 10 links then it doesn't exist. Proposed deletion is absurd. Read the book.

Wonderfully touchy and even misses the fact that I did check the book as best as possible. Since the author didn't provide a page number in their citation, one has to resort to searching the book electronically, which I did, and found nothing. Neither my local library nor my larger regional library owns the book or I'd have gone to get it just to be a completionist.

In the interests of being nice and thorough before taking this to XfD, I did some extra checking this morning, and again, I found basically nothing to support the idea that this is an encyclopedically notable variety of tomatoes. There's absolutely nothing on the following databases or collections of plant/tomato varieties: Rutgers NJAES, Plant variety database - European Commission, University of Saskatchewan Vegetable Program database, Plants for a Future, and Cornell's Vegetable Varieties for Gardeners. The only database with an entry for this variety is Garden.org, but the edit links confirm that it's user-generated, so we can't trust it.

Sadly, not a lot of tomato-focused books are available for preview on Google or Amazon, but the one I could check, Epic Tomatoes, doesn't include it.

I ran the scientific name given on Garden.org ("Solanum lycopersicum 'Pumpkin'") through Google and didn't get any useful results either. Hell, I even checked Newspapers.com, Taylor and Francis, JSTOR, and Highbeam, just because they're there, and again, it's all noise from recipe books, gardening tips, or scientific studies that mention the pumpkin and the tomato as separate plants but next to one another in the text. I'd be delighted to check anything else anyone can suggest but at this stage I'm quite out of ideas. &spades;PMC&spades; (talk) 23:11, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Food and drink-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 00:19, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Science-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 00:19, 11 November 2018 (UTC)


 * Delete I can't find anything either. And while the editor is correct that online presence of sources is not required, if the term per se is entirely absent online, and only a single purported book ever names it, then that is not sufficient for verifiability or demonstration of commonality of the term. There seems to be any number of cultivars that look like something that had better remained inside of a heifer, and I suspect that many are subject to unofficial names and/or subdivisions. As with dog races, not all of these are suited for inclusion in WP. -- Elmidae (talk · contribs) 10:53, 11 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. One of the pillars of Wikipedia is Verifiability.  PMC has demonstrated that verifiability is not achieved with the content in this article.  I note that the Wikidata page (w:wikidata:Q7259857) lists pumpkin tomato as an instance of a "hoax".  Deli nk (talk) 23:23, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Even with the sources mentioned by Frank C. Muller below, the article content remains unverified and notability is definitely not established. Deli nk (talk) 11:18, 15 November 2018 (UTC)


 * Delete. Lack of sources points to this being a hoax. Article was created on April Fools' day 2012. According to TinEye], a version of the image uploaded by the article creator has been here since August 17 2011.Plantdrew (talk) 00:47, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
 * It appears that pumpkin tomatoes exist per Frank C. Müller's links below, but notability isn't established. I'm still concerned about the apparent copyright violation with the photo. And although valid articles may be created on April 1st, there are some pretty fishy statements in the article. "up to the size of a pumpkin"; very doubtful unless we're talking about smaller than usual pumpkins (world record tomato is 3.9 kg, and pumpkins being hollow will be larger than a tomato of the same weight). "mixed up with peppers due to their size and the characteristic nitrogen stripes which cause the characteristic "pumpkin" ribs"; ribs or not, it's pretty hard to mix up a tomato with a pepper. And what the hell are "nitrogen stripes"? Plantdrew (talk) 19:30, 13 November 2018 (UTC)


 * Delete. I couldn't find/confirm a suitable reference. The photo appears to be Marmande tomatoes. Axl ¤ [Talk] 13:39, 13 November 2018 (UTC)


 * Keep. There are at least two serious online-sources:
 * http://www.tomaten-atlas.de/sorten/p/1920-pumpkin
 * http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Pumpkin
 * --Frank C. Müller (talk) 16:42, 13 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Well, that confirms that they exist, but Tomaten-Atlas is getting their photos from Tatiana's Tomatobase, and Tatiana's site is a Wiki. There's still a dearth of reliable sources supporting notability of these tomatoes. Plantdrew (talk) 19:30, 13 November 2018 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.