Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Raleigh Downtown Live


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   no consensus.  Phantom Steve / talk &#124; contribs \ 23:40, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Raleigh Downtown Live

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Deprodded with a WP:BIGNUMBER argument that 70,000 visitors = notability. However, I could only find press releases and trivial mentions ("Artist X is performing at Raleigh Downtown Live"). Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 00:09, 24 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Note: This debate has been included in the Article Rescue Squadron's list of content for rescue consideration.  D r e a m Focus  00:24, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions.   D r e a m Focus  00:26, 24 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Neutral they certainly have plenty of big-name acts, which would suggest (though I guess not prove) a degree of notability. Is the 70,000 visitors the total across all the 35 concerts?  If so, that would mean an average of 2000 people each, which isn't really much: we'd probably (quite rightly) delete an anime or sci-fi convention with similar average attendence.  So I'm split: big-name acts but (apparently) unimpressive attendence.  Neutral until I see what kind of sources show up. Andrew Lenahan -  St ar bli nd  01:57, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * They claim here "annual attendance exceeding 75,000" (which I think tends to support that it's split across all concerts in a given year, making them small). ɠǀɳ̩ςεΝɡ  bomb  15:22, 24 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Surprised Delete ...surprised because, given the caliber of acts present, I'm pretty surprised I can't find more sources. The only reliably sourced coverage I am seeing is already in the article, and it's an article about how the 2011 Downtown Live didn't happen. It actually appears that this annual event is no longer, not that that has any real bearing on the discussion. But...in lieu of proper sourcing, I think this has to be a delete. ɠǀɳ̩ςεΝɡ  bomb  15:29, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment on my own vote Additional sourcing has been found, so I've revisited my opinion here. I still think this should be deleted. It's very plainly not a slam dunk case. The sourcing that has been discovered is largely of incidental nature, however. It's mostly -- and I'm completely paraphrasing here, so assume that I've inadvertently misrepresented things if you wish -- items like "such-and-such bands have joined the festival" and "the festival is now dead." The former is utterly routine, and the latter is...well, it's not routine, but I (personally) feel like I have to discount one or two articles announcing that the festival is no longer. Beyond that, the sourcing seems plainly local in scope. Many festivals get local press for drawing a prominent act or two. Many festivals get local press for shutting down. I'd personally think a notable festival would draw non-local press of an ongoing, significant nature that truly covers the festival itself, and not simply performance announcements and such. ɠǀɳ̩ςεΝɡ  bomb  05:45, 27 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Delete: Hasn't been sourced enough to pass the GNG p  b  p  16:40, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment - Note that additional sources have been found and added to the article after the above !vote was posted. Northamerica1000(talk) 05:51, 2 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Comment - Here are some sources. These first two are essentially local coverage from Raleigh, North Carolina. They're from the Deep South Entertainment article. Perhaps these two articles could be mergeable into one. Here's the sources:
 * Joan Jett to Play Raleigh Downtown Live
 * A source from Music.mync.com/, which describes itself as "Music from Raleigh, Durham, Chapel Hill and the surrounding Triangle area". This may be interpreted as regional coverage:
 * A news source currently in the Raleigh Downtown Live article:
 * — Northamerica1000(talk) 19:52, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * A news source currently in the Raleigh Downtown Live article:
 * — Northamerica1000(talk) 19:52, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * — Northamerica1000(talk) 19:52, 24 April 2012 (UTC)


 * If its a free concert which has famous bands at it, wouldn't it get ample attendance and coverage? Google news archive doesn't include all news sources, but still, its should have more than it does if this information is true.   D r e a m Focus  19:50, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Not necessarily. A Saginaw radio station does a free concert and has done so for years. It gets big names and draws 90,000+ people each year. And yet the only coverage I've ever seen of it is in the Saginaw and Bay City newspapers. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 20:11, 24 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Keep The music mync site is hosted by http://www2.nbc17.com/ the local NBC station. And newsobserver seems to be a reliable site.  All things considered, I say its notable enough to have a Wikipedia article.   D r e a m Focus  20:08, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * The NBC source is still fluffy and promotional, doing nothing but listing off acts that will be there. It uses slang like "booked a string of pretty washed up artists" and an improper semicolon, too. Ten Pound Hammer • (What did I screw up now?) 20:13, 24 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Comment - There's a related AfD discussion occurring for the Deep South Entertainment article, located here: Articles for deletion/Deep South Entertainment. Northamerica1000(talk) 20:24, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Comment - More sources found:
 * More significant coverage from Music.mync.com/
 * Two short newsblog articles, from The News & Observer:
 * The devil went down to Raleigh Downtown Live
 * Candlebox to open Raleigh Downtown Live 2009
 * — Northamerica1000(talk) 21:09, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * — Northamerica1000(talk) 21:09, 24 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Keep – per the two sources I've listed above in this discussion from Music.mync.com/,  coverage in The News & Observer, particularly , which constitutes significant coverage, and the New Raleigh sources. This topic appears to meet WP:GNG. Northamerica1000(talk) 21:14, 24 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. Some of the sources suggested above are blogs etc. A mention (currently not present) at Moore Square Historic District is all that is needed. -- Alan Liefting (talk - contribs) 00:28, 26 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Keep Often the references for a topic like this are mere notices,  but a quick check of the references in the articles shows they prove notability . When a series of events warrants   articles on its closure, it was notable .  DGG ( talk ) 00:55, 26 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, → B  music  ian  11:42, 1 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Delete, surprisingly I'm with Ginsengbomb: I'm kind of surprised that for something with such big-name acts, better sourcing doesn't seem to exist. But we've looked and found nothing besides some 'so-and-so will appear' listings and a couple of short pieces saying it was ending and not much else.  If there was any thing better out there we would have found it by now. Andrew Lenahan -  St ar bli nd  09:51, 4 May 2012 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.