Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Raymond Cilliers


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. -- RoySmith (talk) 15:18, 5 August 2019 (UTC)

Raymond Cilliers

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Fails WP:BASIC, WP:ANYBIO, and WP:MUSICBIO. Unable to locate any significant biographical details in secondary sources. No indication of awards or charted songs. The entire biography and each song link are the work of the same editor, and except for those linked songs, this article is an orphan. This article offered a short promotional biography. Magnolia677 (talk) 18:26, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 22:56, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 22:56, 13 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Christianity-related deletion discussions. Icewhiz (talk) 06:07, 14 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of South Africa-related deletion discussions. Icewhiz (talk) 06:07, 14 July 2019 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Masum Reza 📞 18:23, 20 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep Searching his name turns up these two entries on Google Books: https://books.google.com/books?isbn=0798136359 and https://books.google.com/books?id=QtkxAQAAIAAJ, which along with the daystar.com article is three sources. Additionally, the nominator does not demonstrate any checking of either Afrikaans language or offline sources, given his work in the 1990s, one should check the indexes of genre-related periodicals.--Epiphyllumlover (talk) 03:16, 22 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep His album Gloryland was certified gold by Recording Industry of South Africa which meets WP:MUSICBIO. -- SamCordes Talk 04:34, 25 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Comment I am undecided for now, but this should be relisted at minimum because there are still 2 issues here:
 * 1) His album getting a certifiable gold is unverifiable, and goes against our policy at WP:V. If there is a proof he got one, a Keep per WP:MUSICBIO Criteria 3 would be applicable. But for now, that can't be said.
 * 2) The book sources both seem to be passing mentions from the snippet views Google Books offers, which does not represent WP:SIGCOV. I have yet to see a proof that the subject is notable (WP:NRV applies). WP:MUSTBESOURCES also applies, as "any claim that sources exist must be verifiable", so we can't assume that he was covered in "genre-related periodicals". Jovanmilic97 (talk) 18:53, 27 July 2019 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Sandstein   07:32, 28 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Verification for gold status:About Raymond Cilliers. As for Google books in particular the one authored by Pieter Pieterse appears to be more than a passing mention, although I only have access to snippet view. The Vuka SA Google books is possibly only a passing mention; also both are foreign language. Someone with knowledge of Afrikaans would have better luck searching for and evaluating the sources.--Epiphyllumlover (talk) 05:26, 1 August 2019 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.