Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Really Free Band


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. &spades;PMC&spades; (talk) 20:42, 2 February 2021 (UTC)

Really Free Band

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Contested PROD. I can find no sources to support the band's notability. There is no mention of them in Encyclopedia of Contemporary Christian Music, although it's slightly more US-centric. The UK-based crossrhythms has an entry that is remarkably short. The Internet is void of WP:RSes that discuss them. Fails WP:GNG and WP:MUSICBIO. Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:05, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:05, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Christianity-related deletion discussions. Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:05, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of United Kingdom-related deletion discussions. Walter Görlitz (talk) 15:05, 8 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Delete Absolutely zero coverage. SK2242 (talk) 15:31, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete Great band name, but they are not notable. The sourcing isn't worth crap - discogs is not a reliable source, and the other two sites aren't even about the band. The simple name also makes searching difficult, so I searched with the albums and I couldn't find anything that establishes notability. GhostDestroyer100 (talk) 21:46, 8 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete per all of the above; the entire article is pure WP:OR and we have no way of verifying any of it Spiderone  15:16, 9 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment Apparently a former member, Denis Blackham, went on to be a notable audio mastering engineer. That does not affect the lack of RSes for the band, particularly the band does not even get a mention in his article. Walter Görlitz (talk) 01:05, 13 January 2021 (UTC)

Hi. I’m not sure why the Really Free Band page is being considered for deletion.

Really Free Band were a pioneering Christian Rock band in the United Kingdom, playing at the inaugural Greenbelt festival.

Really Free Band essentially created the genre of Christian Gospel/Rock in the United Kingdom.

Their ministry won hundreds, thousands of souls for the Lord Jesus Christ over the decades.

Thank you. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.243.23.114 (talk) 22:04, 13 January 2021 (UTC) I have approached the UK Premier Christianity' magazineto see if they can find information regarding Really Free in their archives. The magazine is the successor to 'Buzz' magazine which I recall carried an article about Really Free circa 1980. However, there is no searchable online archive index available so I await their response. I have also put calls out on the Unofficial Greenbelt facebook page and the Musical Gospel Outreach MGO facebook page. Thankyou for your patience. Andy Meek (talk) 17:01, 18 January 2021 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Relisting comment: Relisting to provide Andy a further couple of days to find relevant Reliable Sources to justify notability.
 * The reason is that while they were a pioneer of the genre in the UK, we cannot find anything that is written about them in reliable sources. If you could provide significant written content, in sources that are reliable like books, magazines, periodicals or newpapers, but not blogs or self-published sources, then we could feel confident that the content that is displayed in the article is correct, but also that the band was worth being written about. For example, there are several contemporaries in California that were written about and many that were not. We try to have articles about the ones that were written about. For instance, gives Malcolm and Alwyn (and their side projects) a full page of coverage, and they have an article here. Ian Smale and his side projects gets a half page, but also mentions in one other article, while Andy McCarroll gets a quarter page, and neither have an article here. The book does not mention "Really Free" once. So you can see the dilemma. If you could supply the sources that discuss them, that would help us to save their article. Walter Görlitz (talk) 06:24, 14 January 2021 (UTC)
 * I have added references to the long-established (40 years) British independent Christian record company, Plankton whose founder Simon Law (now Revd Simon Law) was a member of Really Free. In a 1996 interview in the CrossRhythms magazine, he described the influence of his membership of Really Free in founding Plankton. This is reinforced by the warm tribute to Cliff Bergdahl that he wrote recently on the company's web site. Andy Meek (talk) 22:30, 15 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Thank you. They're all passing mentions of the band or incidental. Wikipedia needs significant coverage of the band itself that is supplied in reliable sources that are independent of the subject. Walter Görlitz (talk) 23:36, 15 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Malcolm & Alwyn and Ismale played ‘acoustic orientated’ mor Christian songs on what were the main Christian record labels of the time. Hence being recorded in publications such as you cite. Really Free were, in the UK, the first Rock Band playing Christian music and were of no interest to the Christian record labels of the time. Indeed, it was the foresight of individuals such as Simon Law, setting up his own record label (Plankton), to address this that saw the 1st exposure of this sort of music. For this reason you are unlikely to be able to corroborate its significance though mainstream Christian media of the time. We were ignored by it. As a member of the band for several years I can attest to this. Sorry if I’ve not understood the process here but can provide further details as needed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mattthewombat (talk • contribs) 15:35, 17 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Malcolm & Alwyn do play acoustic and folk while Ian Smale has played a wide variety of music. Wild's music in the early 80s was certainly rock while Wall's solo music was not middle of the road either. The point, however, is not what they play but whether they are or are not recognized (as we write in Canada, or recognised as it would be written in much of the UK). As I pointed out, Cross Rhythms does not have much detail on them, and it does cover rock bands from the era (Bill Mason Band were punk, Giantkiller were rock, and while not British Jerusalem are covered in great detail). If you can find any reliable sources that discuss them, and even one, that would help. It does not have to be online. It can be in-print. It would be even better if it were to state that they were instrumental in helping later Christian rock bands. Without reliable sources, we cannot ascertain the notability of bands or solo performers. Walter Görlitz (talk) 05:46, 18 January 2021 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Daniel (talk) 03:09, 20 January 2021 (UTC) Andy Meek (talk) 16:40, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Really Free are listed on the artists roster in an advert for the inaugural Greenbelt festival in the August 1974 edition of Buzz magazine. An image is available here Greenbelt advert 1974.
 * Really Free were listed in the Christian Music Association (CMA) handbook for 1990 published by Word (UK), noting that CMA was founded in the UK as an arm of the American Gospel Music Association. Handbook images here CMA Handbook 1990 front cover and CMA Handbook 1990 p.288
 * I have added a reference to a newspaper article which describes the work of Really Free in a school. There is no online archive, but the page can be seen here Ruislip and Northwood Gazette 14 February 1980 and the article in close-up here Pupils' Free concert [[User:Qa66qa|Andy Meek] (talk) 20:01, 22 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Thank you for doing that, but it's not really significant coverage. Walter Görlitz (talk) 22:49, 22 January 2021 (UTC)


 * Merge / redirect with Denis Blackham. (COI alert - I met Denis once and he's a nice guy and very insightful about the audio mastering process such as multi-band compression). Ritchie333 (talk) (cont)  12:21, 28 January 2021 (UTC)
 * That does not make sense. Blackham was not a prominent member listed as only having been with them for a year at most, and the problem with the article is lack of reliable sourcing. I'm not sure what is left after the poor-quality content is removed. Walter Görlitz (talk) 18:41, 28 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete - not enough significant coverage to pass WP:GNG, and doesn't meet WP:NBAND.  Onel 5969  TT me 19:45, 30 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete - does not meet WP:BAND – Has not been "the subject of multiple, non-trivial, published works appearing in sources that are reliable, not self-published, and are independent of the musician or ensemble itself" - cheers, Epinoia (talk) 01:27, 31 January 2021 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.