Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Roy Neuberger

 This page is an archive of the proposed deletion of the article below. Further comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or on a Votes for Undeletion nomination). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result of the debate was KEEP. Please take any further legal challenges to the Wikimedia Foundation. -Splash 01:55, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

Roy_Neuberger
Kaufman Gartner, p.c. ATTORNEYS AT LAW 114 West 47th Street, 22nd Floor NEW YORK, NEW YORK 10036 TELEPHONE: (212) 575-4886 Ÿ FAX: (212) 575-5979

August 9, 2005

To: Wikipedia

The article about Roy Neuberger should be deleted immediately for the following reasons: it contains a malicious, personal attack on Mr. Neuberger and his son, Roy S. Neuberger, and entirely falsifies their relationship - which is close and not at all estranged - and contains anti-Semitic overtones. Mere editing will be insufficient, because the earlier version would always be accessible. The article is causing family members great pain and must be deleted; it serves no good purpose to let it remain online. The attached article contains accurate information about Mr. Neuberger and should replace the deleted article. Sincerely, James Kaufman Esq. Attorney for Roy R. Neuberger and Family 70.110.155.253 18:39, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

Roy Neuberger (born July 21, 1903) is an American financier who has contributed to the cause of public awareness and publicity of modern art through acquisition of painting and sculpture and donation of many pieces of art to educational institutions and museums. He is the founding partner and eponym of the investment firm Neuberger &amp; Berman. Neuberger was born in Bridgeport, Connecticut, and spent his childhood in New York. He was orphaned at the age of 12. He describes himself as having been interested during high school in tennis and "the ladies". He matriculated at New York University, originally to study journalism, but grew restless and dropped out without obtaining a degree. His first job was working at B. Altman's, then the leading Manhattan department store. There he learned the ins and outs of business. Leaving his job at Altman's, he sailed to Europe at age 20 on an inheritance from his parents and went to live in Paris. He lived his bohemian, Roaring Twenties existence there, where he visited the Louvre three times a week and met his lifelong friend Meyer Shapiro. He studied art in Paris and throughout Europe. In 1928 he read Floret Fels' biography of Vincent Van Gogh. Neuberger was startled when he learned how Van Gogh had only sold one painting, and was heartstricken to learn that Van Gogh, like so many other artists, had lived in pain, poverty and misery. Thousands of excellent artists were suffering in obscurity and the world might never know what they had created. Neuberger wanted a way to give deserving but unknown artists a chance at fame, recognition and financial success. To accomplish this, Neuberger decided to go "where the money is." He moved back to the United States and entered Wall Street in 1929, seven months before Black Tuesday. He started out with the firm of Halle &amp; Steiglitz and sold RCA shares short, right through the stock market crash at the beginning of the Great Depression. He founded Neuberger &amp; Berman in 1939 with Robert Berman. By then he was in a position to make his first major acquisition, Peter Hurd's Boy from the Plains. He allowed Nelson Rockefeller, another avid art collector, to use Boy from the Plains in a travelling American art exhibition. Rockefeller's exhibition travelled to South America. Among the other major artists whose works Neuberger collected are Jackson Pollock, Ben Shahn, William Baziotes, Alexander Calder, Stuart Davis, Louis Eilshemius, Edward Hopper, Jacob Lawrence, Jack Levine, David Smith and especially Milton Avery. Neuberger purchased dozens of Averys, the first of which was Gaspé Landscape, which he bought during a snowstorm. The artist wrapped it carefully to protect the canvas in the way home. It still hangs in Neuberger's apartment to this day. Neuberger also began donating works to institutions, among them the Metropolitan Museum of Art, the Museum of Modern Art and the Whitney Museum as well as many college and university museums. Neuberger's friend and fellow collector Nelson Rockefeller, when he became governor of New York arranged for the donation of a substantial portion of Neuberger's collection to the state. To this end, he established a Neuberger Museum of Art as part of the State University of New York. Designed by architect Philip Johnson, the Neuberger Museum opened on the SUNY Purchase College campus and opened in 1974. Neuberger was married for over 60 years to the late Marie Salant Neuberger, also a distinguished patron of the arts. Together they had three children and many grandchildren. }} 70.110.155.253 19:26, 9 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Keep The vfd is a blatant attempt to intimidate WP into changing this into a POV article written the way the subject wants it written. Relevant material from Neuberger's proposed version can be merged in. I don't see any anti-Semitic overtones at all.--Bcrowell 19:37, 9 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Keep if that's the best the OP can do. The article obviously needs a lot of work, but with patience it can be cleaned up into something worthwhile.  (Is it okay to editorialise here?  If so, here goes: The stated reason of "you must delete it because mere changes aren't good enough for us" is bollocks, and extraordinarily arrogant besides). --MarkGallagher 19:55, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

Keep, block user for making legal threats. Zoe 20:16, August 9, 2005 (UTC)
 * Strong Keep but I bet it gets vandalised frequently Tonywalton
 * Strong Keep Per Bcrowell. Eclipsed 20:27, 9 August 2005 (UTC)


 * Keep, if the user wants to modify the article he can get an account and make the changes himself. VfD is inappropriate in this instance.Gateman1997 20:50, 9 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Actually, the article (before I just edited it) did incorrectly state that father and son were estranged. I've fixed it, and sourced a Ha'aretz article that quotes both father and son getting along as G-d and Ethical Culture intends. Nothing anti-semetic at all about this, at least when I last looked . There may be some copyvio issues, though -- someone please check it more closely. Sdedeo 21:51, 9 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Comment, oh, yes, and fight the man. Sdedeo 22:00, 9 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep and cleanup. If Mr. Kaufman doesn't like the article, he is welcome to contribute, but deleting page histories because they are offensive isn't how Wikipedia works and we shouldn't change that here. Blocking his IP from editing is a lousy idea not yet necessary - ideally, we would like him to help us write a truthful, neutral article. Explodicle 23:22, 9 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Please see No legal threats. This is official Wikipedia policy.  Zoe 23:47, August 9, 2005 (UTC)
 * Good point. If I wasn't aware of this, though, there's a chance he wasn't, so we should at least give him a chance. Explodicle 23:57, 9 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. I see no reason for deletion under Wikipedia policy. VfD is not the place to determine whether the policy of retaining the edit history is legally tenable. Martg76 23:31, 9 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep no reason to delete. -- Etacar11   00:57, 10 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep and thumb nose. Gazpacho 03:15, 10 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Strong Keep Per Bcrowell --Apyule 06:49, 10 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep, deleting due to legal threats is unprecedented, and the day it happens is the day I leave the project.  ral  315  14:35, August 10, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. The article could still use some work, but legal threats are just pointless and silly.  --Several Times 15:44, 10 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Address legal threats to Jimbo Wales.     ( ! | ? | * ) 19:51, 10 August 2005 (UTC)
 * Comment: while we are clearly within our rights (in the US anyway) to maintain this article, it does seem a bit mean spirited to devote so many words to airing Mr. Neuberger's trouble with his own son. Collabi 05:46, 11 August 2005 (UTC)
 * What do you mean? I just edited it to mention the two of them get along. Explodicle 04:13, 12 August 2005 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in an undeletion request). No further edits should be made to this page.