Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Sabih Arca


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Aoidh (talk) 02:25, 17 April 2023 (UTC)

Sabih Arca

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)


 * Delete: Fails GNG and BIO. BEFORE showed nothing that meets SIGCOV addressing the subject directly and indepth.
 * Sources:
 * Photo :: 1.  "cache-v2". donanimhaber.
 * Database record :: 2. ^ "National football team player Sabih Arca". EU Football. Retrieved 2022-08-15.
 * Turkish content provider article, not IS RS with SIGCOV :: 3. ^ "Sabih Arca". Retrieved 2022-08-15.
 * bout Fenerbahçe, does not mention subject :: 4. ^ Hay Eytan Cohen Yanarocak (2012-05-28). "The Last Stronghold: The Fenerbahçe Sports Club and Turkish Politics". Dayan. Retrieved 2022-08-15.
 * Team History, nothing about subject :: 5. ^ "A Milli Takım Tarihçesi" (in Turkish). Turkiye Futbol Federasyonu. n.d. Retrieved 2022-08-15.
 * Failed V, 404 :: 6. ^ "Sabih Arca Efsane Forvet" (in Turkish). mujdatyetkiner.com. Retrieved 2022-08-15.
 * Database record :: 7. ^ "Sabih Arca". Olympedia. Retrieved 25 August 2021.

No sources in article are IS RS SIGCOV. BEFORE showed nothing with IS RS SIGCOV addressing the subject directly and indepth.  // Timothy :: talk  21:15, 9 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sportspeople, Football,  and Turkey. Shellwood (talk) 21:36, 9 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Olympics-related deletion discussions.  Spiderone (Talk to Spider) 21:48, 9 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Spiderone (Talk to Spider) 22:07, 9 April 2023 (UTC)
 * This looks like someone who is highly, highly—very highly likely notable. Arca played literally 200+ games for one of the best teams in Turkish history over 100 years ago, scoring 64 goals (showing he was not just some career-long bench player) and was on the first Turkish national team in history, earning nine caps and additionally being on the team at two Olympics. BeanieFan11 (talk) 22:42, 9 April 2023 (UTC)
 * This would be an enormous shame to delete – it looks like Arca was one of the best players of his era and I'm 99.999999999999999999999% certain there's offline coverage somewhere. BeanieFan11 (talk) 22:46, 9 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Looking for sources, I see this piece from a Turkish bio website (which mentions him as one of the most successful players in the early era of Turkish soccer, also seems to be at ), and then this seems to be a list of articles mentioning him? BeanieFan11 (talk) 22:59, 9 April 2023 (UTC)
 * de.wikipedia has a very decent biography on him with several offline references. Also, I requested at the Turkish Wikipedia help in finding sources. BeanieFan11 (talk) 23:31, 9 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep - Per above. Clearly significant figure in Turkish football. Thanks, Das osmnezz (talk) 05:04, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep per sources above which show notability. GiantSnowman 11:55, 10 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Source eval Nonne of the sources above shows IS RS with SIGCOV.
 * Social media type provider, not IS RS :: https://www.turkcebilgi.com/sabih_arca#post
 * Social media type provider, not IS RS :: http://www.kimkimdir.net.tr/kisiler/sabih-arca
 * Search results page, no SIGCOV :: https://fenerbahcetarihi.org/tag/sabih-arca/
 * Has references to teams, stats, nothing with SIGCOV. :: Turkish Wikipedia
 * Nothing with IS RS SIGCOV addressing the subject directly and indepth.  // Timothy :: talk  08:55, 11 April 2023 (UTC)
 * did you attempt to access the ample offline sources in the German-language article in your BEFORE or source eval? GGT (talk) 11:31, 11 April 2023 (UTC)
 * There aren't any offline sources in the de.wp.; All are available online. More promo and ROUTINE, nothing is IS RS with SIGCOV addressing the subject directly and indepth.  // Timothy :: talk  11:42, 11 April 2023 (UTC)


 * Keep. Pretty broad-stroke statements on part of the nom here that show a deficient evaluation of the sources and the subject matter. I'm not talking about non-RS like turkcebilgi.com here. Anyone familiar with the history of Turkish press knows that for flagship publications like Milliyet or Hürriyet, promo pieces didn't exist until essentially the last 10-15 years (due to changes in ownership/media dynamics, one may wish to read Emin Çölaşan's memoirs to understand this process), so no way that those sources from the 1960s are "promo". The Milliyet sources are pretty difficult to access as they require Flash Player, but I'm able to access at least two: a piece from 21 March 1967 that discusses the new board of Fenerbahçe and gives a brief biography of Arca, and an obituary published on 25 April 1979. Now the fact remains that even these are decades after this guy's active football career. That was a time when Turkish surnames had not yet been introduced, so any mention of this person is more likely to be as "Sabih" only, making it even more difficult to locate. Furthermore, the Turkish alphabet was only Latinised in 1928, and of course, all of the sports publications of that era (particularly Spor Alemi) remain fully offline. We do, however, have modern coverage such as this article in Sabah about the history of Fenerbahçe which gives a one-paragraph biography of Arca as a "legendary forward". This is a very strong indicator that this guy had such lasting notability that he would be listed as a legend in articles a full century after his football career. As such, 1) the posthumous coverage on its own is sufficient to meet GNG in the barest of terms (but this is bearing in mind that we're looking at the archives of only one newspaper...) and 2) more importantly, it indicates that contemporary in-depth coverage is almost certain to exist. If someone does end up browsing through magazines in a Turkish library, please do ping me. --GGT (talk) 12:12, 11 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep, per GGT. BeanieFan11 (talk) 13:47, 11 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep per GGT. Aintabli (talk) 06:11, 13 April 2023 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.