Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/San Antonio Steers


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   delete. If anyone believes other team articles from this league should be deleted, please list them separately (individually or in a mass nomination), as there was no consensus regarding the other league articles. &mdash;Darkwind (talk) 02:57, 7 April 2013 (UTC)

San Antonio Steers

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

Fails WP:Notability Fnordware (talk) 19:28, 28 March 2013 (UTC)


 * I agree that this page has trouble meeting notability guidelines and has no reliable sources, but the same could be said for pretty much every team in the National Indoor Football League. Should they all be deleted? Perhaps they should. Indeed, the page for the entire league hardly has any sources, despite an impressive network of Wikipedia pages. Fnordware (talk) 19:30, 28 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Texas-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 10:09, 29 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 10:09, 29 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of American football-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 10:09, 29 March 2013 (UTC)


 * Delete no independent sources at all. Plus the phrase "The Steers would finish 2nd in the Pacific South Division..." is suspect.  Maybe it's just editing, but it seems really strange to me.--Paul McDonald (talk) 12:36, 29 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Delete fails WP:GNG like my prod rationale Secret account 16:06, 29 March 2013 (UTC)

OK, but how do you feel about deleting the entire National Indoor Football League network? Or at least all the individual team pages? Fnordware (talk) 16:48, 29 March 2013 (UTC)
 * The issue is that they need to be considered on a case by case basis as a few of the teams technically meet WP:GNG by playing in other notable leagues like af2. Prod (or in rare cases) redirect are the best solution to this problem. Secret account 17:11, 29 March 2013 (UTC)
 * I would rather handle each article separately. I think this one has the potential to be saved if good third party sources are found.  And that is likely the case with the others.--Paul McDonald (talk) 18:10, 29 March 2013 (UTC)
 * I agree that merge/redirect is the way to go. If there is ever a reason to resurrect the articles or someone is just curious, the history will be there. Most of these teams are defunct, so not too likely. Pages with no sources should be easy redirect choices. Someone did a lot of work on this though. Fnordware (talk) 21:30, 30 March 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm good with redirects.--Paul McDonald (talk) 00:15, 31 March 2013 (UTC)
 * The problem with many of these semi-professional teams is that they played in multiple barely notable leagues, leaving a confusing redirect target in many cases. And I can't see the point of redirecting one team if others probably needs to be deleted because of that confusion, not to mention the league themselves is barely passing GNG. Secret account 05:35, 31 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep as I've improved and expanded this article in an initial rescue effort with multiple reliable-third party references. Before this, I had no idea what a rollercoaster ride the 2007 NIFL season became as the league reached its ugly end. Still, I believe that this article now crosses the verifiability and notability thresholds. I will continue rescue efforts as time permits. - Dravecky (talk) 12:23, 31 March 2013 (UTC)
 * We all know that Our Sports Central is not and never been considered as a reliable source for anything as it's all fan based or press release contribution content without much moderation. Once in a while it is ok for a primary source as many smaller teams use it as a type of a PR release website. Still fails WP:GNG unless you can provide more sourcing why this particular team is notable. Secret account 19:59, 31 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Interesting to note that Our Sports Central itself doesn't even have a Wikipedia article. There seems to be some dedicated fans that have written a whole network of articles about this this league as well as af2, but even the articles about the overall league are lacking reliable sources. I appreciate their enthusiasm, but this is a perfect example of when someone should start their own Wiki for a subject they are interested in, not put it in Wikipedia. Fnordware (talk) 22:58, 31 March 2013 (UTC)
 * I was using OSC as a primary source to support verifiability only. I'll confess that the Steers, as a league-owned team playing a very short season during the death-throes of the NIFL, are quite likely the least notable of the NIFL teams but there's enough verifiable content about an under-covered topic that I'd hate to see it simply deleted. Perhaps selective merging to a List of National Indoor Football teams article is in order for those teams which cannot support a standalone article. Essentially a fork of a parent National Indoor Football League article, the notability threshold would be more easily crossed. - Dravecky (talk) 09:13, 1 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Dravecky, assuming the NIFL is notable, I would have no objection to including a one-paragraph description of each NIFL team, either in the main NIFL article or a spinoff list article. Again, assuming the notability of the NIFL, there is nothing to stop you from doing that regardless of the outcome of this AfD.  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 09:51, 1 April 2013 (UTC)
 * There's enough reliable coverage of the league and many of its teams (,, , , , , , , etc.) that notability can be established without much concern. It's only the marginal franchises, especially from the league-fueled expansion disaster in 2007, that are at "risk". For the record, I'm not an NIFL fan but do enjoy both minor league sports and article rescue. - Dravecky (talk) 11:29, 1 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Delete. Fails the general notability guidelines per WP:GNG and the specific notability guidelines applicable to organizations per WP:ORG for lack of substantial, non-trivial, non-routine coverage in multiple, independent, reliable sources.  Searches of Google News and Google News Archive reveal nothing more than trivial mentions in game schedules or minimalist game coverage.  OurSportsCentral.com has "published" numerous press releases on-line, but OSC does not constitute an independent media organization when it functions as a conduit for press releases.  BTW, what kind of mascot is the steer for a football team, anyway?  A neutered bull?  Someone really thought that was an appropriate mascot?  Dirtlawyer1 (talk) 23:11, 31 March 2013 (UTC)
 * The NIFL was a collection of terrible team names and the San Antonio franchise launched as the "Player Haters"... which had to make recruiting players a challenge. - Dravecky (talk) 09:13, 1 April 2013 (UTC)


 * Redirect to National Indoor Football League. J04n(talk page) 11:38, 4 April 2013 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.