Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Second American Revolution


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. There is a consensus to keep the content but not entirely clear what should be done with it Spartaz Humbug! 22:31, 26 May 2020 (UTC)

Second American Revolution

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This is a non-notable topic that at best deserves a sentence in the main American Revolution article. Previous PROD attempt was removed. Ed [talk] [majestic titan] 05:30, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions.  userdude 05:41, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of United States of America-related deletion discussions.  userdude 05:41, 10 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment. It doesn't really seem connected to the actual American Revolution outside of name, so I don't think it would belong on that article. userdude 05:45, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
 * I agree with both of the above comments. As I said on the WikiProject United States talk page], the "Second American Revolution" article says: "Rhetorical or hyperbolic references to a Second American Revolution have been made on a number of occasions throughout the history of the United States." That's thin gruel to justify an entire article, and actually misleading, as the title gives the impression at first sight that two American Revolutionary Wars were fought. Carlstak (talk) 05:48, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
 * I think the content ought to be included somewhere, and it doesn't fit in on American Revolution. If the current title is misleading, would moving the page work? Maybe to something like, List of conflicts referred to as Second American Revolution or List of events referred to as Second American Revolution? — Preceding unsigned comment added by UserDude (talk • contribs) 20:12, 11 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Move to Second American Revolution (historiography), as proposed by CJK09. userdude 00:16, 19 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Comment. My sense is that this article is intended to serve as a dabconcept for the phrase, which is linked in a large number of articles because it is a recurrent theme in speculative fiction. Uses in fiction were fairly extensively cataloged in a previous version of the article (albeit poorly sourced), which was summarily removed last year. BD2412  T 14:34, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Comment -- This is not a recognised term. However the fact that several historians have used it in different contexts suggests that something is needed, but I wonder if this is not better dealt with in a dictionary than an encyclopedia.  Peterkingiron (talk) 14:54, 10 May 2020 (UTC)
 * It could be served by a disambiguation page. Coming from the Wiktionary side I can tell you that this would be considered as a non-idiomatic sum-of-parts and rejected for inclusion in the dictionary. BD2412  T 17:03, 10 May 2020 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Move to Second American Revolution (historiography). This is about a concept in historiography, not a well-defined historical event, and the title should reflect that to avoid misleading people. The article should not be deleted - it's not a neologism, passes GNG with flying colors, and serves a useful purpose in discussing the various events that historians have labeled as a second American revolution. CJK09 (talk) 21:46, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Barkeep49 (talk) 03:09, 18 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Keep and move. We're here to assess the inherent or otherwise notability of the topic. So, firstly, "keep" because it's a common phrase used by numerous relable sources and notable authors. So it is a thing and it's a notable thing. However, I agree with the point, above, that at its curremt location thetitle imples that theer were, literally, two American revolutions, when of course there were not. That does a disservice to the WP:READER. The fact that the phrase is used in different historiographies suggest that it should be under a title that reflects this; provisionally, I'd agree with something like 's Second American Revolution (historiographical term). But, either way, the page title is strictly a discussion for the talk page: ths page is for establishing notability, and has fulfilled its purpose. ——  Serial # 13:30, 26 May 2020 (UTC)
 * No opinion as to keep or delete, but I disagree with moving the article to "Second American Revolution (something)". We use parentheticals for disambiguation, but that is not needed here. Our article titles are not implied or understood to be statements of fact by Wikipedia. For example, A Very Stable Genius is quite possibly not an accurate characterization of the book's subject, the German Democratic Republic was not known for being a democracy, etc.  Sandstein   16:42, 26 May 2020 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.