Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Septimus Heap (character)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   Delete. Although the delete votes did not far exceed the keeps, none of the Keep rationales provided a convincing policy justification. For instance, one of the keep voters said "There is a huge universe created by Angie Sage in the Septimus Heap series and fans are willing to read all the information." Factors that Keep voters should have addressed were WP:PLOT, which is part of policy, and Notability (fiction), which is an essay but has a lot of influence. The Times Online article cited in the AfD discussion clearly shows that the Septimus Heap series of books is notable, and it is well-justified to have an article on the series, which is what Septimus Heap is. But there was no evidence provided that the Septimus Heap *character* has been addressed and commented on by reliable sources. I am willing to userfy the article for anyone who believes they will be able to add sources and improve the article. EdJohnston (talk) 05:21, 15 September 2008 (UTC)

Septimus Heap (character)

 * ( [ delete] ) – (View AfD) (View log)

article on a fictional character that does note cite notability UltraMagnus (talk) 10:43, 10 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I am also nominating Snorri Snorrelssen because it is unreferenced and fails both Notability (fiction) (under Elements of fiction) and Plot. Mr. Absurd (talk) 01:09, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I think it's a little late to add new articles to this nom. Meanwhile, Marcia Overstrand and Jenna Heap have been created, and I think it's best to open a new AfD for the three of them. – sgeureka t•c 09:45, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I agree with sgeureka's reasoning and boldly followed his suggestion, moving Snorri Snorrelssen to WP:Articles for deletion/Jenna Heap with the other newly created pages with exactly the same problems. Huon (talk) 12:01, 12 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Strong KeepThis may be a tiny article, but someone will notice it soon and then begin to edit it with style.--RoryReloaded (talk) 10:47, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Size is irrelevant; it's the notability that counts. Mr. Absurd (talk) 01:10, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete. This unreferenced article fails WP:PLOT because it does not indicate any real-world significance of this fictional character biography. ~ Ningauble (talk) 13:20, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete, no secondary sources to establish real-world context or notability, fails WP:FICT. Huon (talk) 13:22, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Fictional characters-related deletion discussions.   --  Fabrictramp  |  talk to me  13:53, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep This is the main character in a series of books which have received good critical reviews and good sales per Amazon,com. I do not like to see every character, scene, event, spell, location, and gizmo in a book made into a separate article, but a breakout article about the protagonist of a series of books following up on the Harry Potter phenomenon, seems reasonable. See Times online: "Angie Sage's Cornish wizard Septimus Heap follows Harry Potter to Hollywood"which talks about this character, in addition to the book, its author, and the forthcoming Hollywood film.The article says th Heap series has "soared to the top of the book charts." At the same time, I strongly discourage breakout articles for all the other minor characters etc from the series until they have substantial discussion in reliable and independent sources. BBC News also has coverage of this character. Pakistan Dawn discusses this character as well, but expresses regret at the number of characters, a reason for my reluctance to green-light articles for each character. Edison (talk) 17:07, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete/redirect in its current form (pure plot summary at best, pure original research at worst), or upmerge into List of characters in the Septimus Heap series (along with Snorri Snorrelssen and the redlinked characters from the template) to allow the addition of analysis/reception by reliable sources. The mentioned sources above do not convince me that this character can stand on its own as an article (yet), although these sources would be excellent for the main Septimus Heap series article. – sgeureka User_talk:Sgeureka•c 18:14, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment/Very Strong Keep There you go. It's now in the process of getting rescued by WP:ARS. Let's see what happens now, critics! RoryReloaded (talk) 21:24, 10 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Please do not vote more than once. Mr. Absurd (talk) 00:59, 12 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Merge This should probably just be merged to a list of characters from the fiction, or just to the fiction itself.--UltraMagnus (talk) 06:47, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Extreme Keep Septimus is famous and the main character for a well-recieved series of books. Well, I'll be off now... can't waste me time. RoryReloaded (talk) 08:02, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * You have already put in a !vote above. – sgeureka t•c 08:37, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Comment It's good now, so why delete? --RoryReloaded (talk) 09:08, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * What is good now? Double-voting is never accepted, and the article hasn't improved at all (no sources or analysis were added). – sgeureka t•c 09:21, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * If you actually look, he has triple voted....--UltraMagnus (talk) 11:25, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Didn't even notice... – sgeureka t•c 09:03, 12 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Delete. Unreferenced, fails WP:PLOT and Notability (fiction) (under Elements of fiction). A short paragraph of actual character information (not plot regurgitation) can easily be included into the main series article. Mr. Absurd (talk) 00:57, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep This article is about a popular Fiction character. Please guys don't delete it. There is a huge universe created by Angie Sage in the Septimus Heap series and fans are willing to read all the information. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Legolas2186 (talk • contribs) 11:30, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Delete there is no linking to the real world at all, therefore no establishment of notability. From a search I can see no coverage of the character. Nuttah (talk) 07:20, 13 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep a very hasty nomination minutes after creation. It may well fail Notability (fiction) but that is currently just an essay. The other problem with regard to Plot can be fixed with editing. RMHED (talk) 21:58, 14 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.