Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Ship of Lights


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   merge to Seraphs (Battlestar Galactica).  MBisanz  talk 06:13, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

Ship of Lights

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Plot summary for non-notable topic. First reference verifies plot, while second references discuss hypothetical "resurrection" or reference to ship that never happened; all references are in passing and fail to demonstrate significant third-party coverage to establish notability. --EEMIV (talk) 23:30, 21 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Delete. Wikipedia isn't a guide to this type of information. It's non-notable trivia and cruft at best. RobJ1981 (talk) 00:51, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Merge to a List of Battlestar Galactica spacecraft (1978-1980) 76.66.193.69 (talk) 05:51, 22 March 2009 (UTC)

*Merge somewhere — the anon's suggestion of a list of original series Battlestar Galactica spacecraft (on a parallel with the existing List of ships in Battlestar Galactica (2004) is a good one. The material from Cylon Basestar could also be split between these two articles. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 19:18, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Science fiction-related deletion discussions.  —94.196.22.232 (talk) 12:32, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Television-related deletion discussions.  —94.196.22.232 (talk) 12:32, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Merge to somewhere relevant. There's almost certainly more references out there than what this article contains, but really... can it not be handled adequately in the article for the original BSG? Jclemens (talk) 15:51, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep with rewording. It becomes significant towards the end of the series. -- BlueSquadron Raven  22:27, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Any evidence of real-world significance outside the series? --EEMIV (talk) 22:30, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Christ, you could ask that about half the stuff on here, especially regarding fiction. WP:NOTPAPER and all that. As I said, it needs work but should be kept. As it is, the title is not conflicting with anything, so what the heck. -- BlueSquadron Raven  22:41, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Ideally, any aspect of a work of fiction which merits inclusion as a separate entry in Wikipedia should have some indication of real-world significance. But real-world significance need not be defined narrowly: if you see WP:FICT you can see that commentary on the subject is one of the aspects which can help determine real-world significance.  To that end, I had a brief look on Google Books, and found a reference to the Ship of Lights in a book about the history of Mormonism (since the original Battlestar Galactica was deeply influenced by Mormon theology).  I also found a few references in the recent book Battlestar Galactica and Philosophy: one essay talks about the Mormon connection, another points to the Beings of Light as evidence of the original BSG's Manichean world-view.


 * It's not too difficult to find sources like these, and this is the sort of material that Wikipedia articles about elements of fiction should contain. If a reliable source has taken the time to discuss a fictional detail, that detail is notable and deserves its own entry.  If not, it's probably best condensed into an article about the work of fiction as a whole.


 * That said, these sources that I found are probably enough to justify the Ship of Lights and/or the Seraphs having their own page or pages. (Perhaps the two should be combined, but that's another question.)  So I'm going to change my !vote. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 23:25, 22 March 2009 (UTC)


 * Keep and incorporate the sources mentioned above. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 23:25, 22 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Note: I've now added these references to this article and Seraphs (Battlestar Galactica). —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 00:17, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep Notable per the evidence above. Colonel Warden (talk) 23:47, 22 March 2009 (UTC)


 * I think this article and Seraphs (Battlestar Galactica) (which should probably be named "Beings of Light", currently proposed for deletion) should be considered together. The notable mythology and story arc (three episodes and one written but not filmed before cancellation; tied in with Count Iblis, Starbuck and also finding Earth) was powerful beings and their ship: there's two components, the beings and the ship. Also, when people mention Ship of Lights (e.g. another interview with Moore that I added) they often actually mean that combined "Beings and Ship" concept, rather than just the spaceship, i.e. keep and merge with Seraphs (Battlestar Galactica) and rename to Beings of Light if either or both meet criteria 3 (preferred) or keep and merge with and Seraphs (Battlestar Galactica) into another relevant article if they don't satisfy criteria 3. Year Zero is a concept (talk)
 * I support the eventual merger of this and Seraphs (Battlestar Galactica) (from which I removed the prod). I've added the references I found to both of them, but the notability is really shared by both. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 00:20, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
 * I have yet to see any sign of notability. One of these references is in passing in a footnote, and fails to meet the requirement for substantial third-party coverage. --EEMIV (talk) 00:25, 23 March 2009 (UTC)
 * The footnote is part of an extensive discussion of Battlestar Galactica and Mormonism, which is incidental to the book's subject (the history of Mormonism), but it's still fairly substantial. The references in Battlestar Galactica and Philosophy are also substantial, and clearly meet the criteria at WP:FICT.


 * There's also the scholarly article "Battlestar Galactica and Mormonism", from the Journal of Popular Culture; I can't access the article itself, but there are references to it in Battlestar Galactica and Philosophy and this essay, which would strongly suggest that it deals extensively with the Ship of Lights and its inhabitants. If somebody who has access to an academic library wants to check this out and verify, I'd think that would certainly qualify as "substantial third-party coverage". —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 00:43, 23 March 2009 (UTC)


 * Merge to Seraphs article. --Sloane (talk) 22:15, 25 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep, or alternatively, Merge to Seraphs (Battlestar Galactica). Seem to be quite a few references now. - jc37 08:55, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep per cleanup, added refs--SarekOfVulcan (talk) 14:28, 26 March 2009 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.