Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Stewards of Gondor


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was redirect to Gondor. Tone 15:05, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

Stewards of Gondor

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List of fictional individuals holding a fictional position, referenced as usual to WP:PRIMARY sources. Fails WP:GNG/WP:NFICTION, pure WP:PLOT. The concept of this position (or a related list) is not encyclopedic and BEFORE doesn't show anything but few mentions in passing. And of course this will survive in the form of wikia/fandom https://lotr.fandom.com/wiki/Stewards_of_Gondor so nothing will be lost from the Internet following our deletion (just people searching for this will benefit from not having to chose between us and the fan sites). I do not that the wikia doesn't have the generalogy tree which I'd recommend to transwiki there, if any Tolkien fan feels it is useful. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 09:04, 3 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Fictional elements-related deletion discussions. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here  09:04, 3 December 2019 (UTC)


 * Keep. Article on a post which was central to the works of one of the most important writers in history. This recent swathe of attempted deletions of articles on fantasy and science fiction topics makes me uncomfortable, as it suggests that some editors are having fun getting rid of valid content, which is certainly not what Wikipedia is all about. We delete rubbish and very minority interest material. We do not usually delete material that is central to major literary works and games. -- Necrothesp (talk) 13:46, 3 December 2019 (UTC)
 * "We delete rubbish and very minority interest material." Well, this is "very minority interest material" and not "material that is central to major literary works". No scholar of fan of Tolkien can credibly argue that the office of the one of the main themes of the Middleearth stories was the "history and functions of the office of the Steward of Gondor". C'mon. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 05:18, 4 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Fantasy-related deletion discussions. Necrothesp (talk) 14:13, 3 December 2019 (UTC)


 * Delete per TNT. There may well be a way to write this as a notable concept article. However this telling of the fictional history and geneaology of the office is not it. What we would need is sources discussing this topic in reliable, 3rd party sources not written or edited by a Tolkien. This is lacking from this article, so we can delete it and let others start over if they can find reliable discussions of the topic.John Pack Lambert (talk) 18:30, 3 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Gondor. The topic is covered pretty well at that spot, with the main difference being that the list and family tree are not found in the Gondor article.  The list and tree aren't encyclopedic and can be transwikied if necessary, and the good concept material is produced at Gondor.  I found several articles on Google Scholar for this topic, but the references didn't seem to be in-depth enough to indicate sufficient coverage for a stand-alone article. Hog Farm (talk) 20:23, 3 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete — The only significant Steward of Gondor in Tolkien's fiction is Denethor and we have an article about him. The rest is fancrust.--Jack Upland (talk) 01:35, 4 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Gondor This topic would only interest a small segment of Tolkien fans. &#8213; Susmuffin Talk 21:40, 4 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete for being all WP:PLOT. I'd rather not see this merged to Gondor, as it's not a likely search term (one would rather look up Gondor directly), and that target section is already pretty bloated with plot too. – sgeureka t•c 12:17, 5 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete. Pure PLOT. Fails GNG/NFICTION/LISTN.Kacper IV (talk) 12:28, 5 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete Was going to echo the argument above about redirecting to Gondor, as the fictional leaders have zero real-world notability or citation, but that doesn't appear to be on solid ground either. Gondor has about 100 citations, 1 to support the comparison to Byzantine, 1 about language influence, the rest to source material, i.e. Tolkien's books, to support plot elements. ValarianB (talk) 12:59, 5 December 2019 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.