Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Stuart Liddell


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep - Consensus is more or less to keep both. (non-admin closure) – Davey 2010 Talk 23:22, 14 October 2015 (UTC)

Stuart Liddell

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

I am also nominating the following related page:

These people may have won awards for their musicianship and played in award-winning bands, but at the end of the day they're just good amateur musicians. I do not believe they meet WP:GNG in any way. Their awards are not significant enough for WP:ANYBIO. Even professional (generally military) pipe majors and drummers would not generally be notable, let alone leaders of amateur bands. -- Necrothesp (talk) 10:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Scotland-related deletion discussions. Necrothesp (talk) 10:12, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Canada-related deletion discussions. Necrothesp (talk) 10:12, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Musicians-related deletion discussions. Necrothesp (talk) 10:12, 8 October 2015 (UTC)


 * Speedy keep for Stuart Liddell- he has twice been awarded the prize for piping that is regarded as solo world champion in 2009 and again in 2014. The article itself needs a bit of updating and tidying, for example these reliable sources were not included in the article prior to this AfD nomination. However, the awards alone mean that Liddell can be seen to easily be passing WP:GNG and WP:ANYBIO. Drchriswilliams (talk) 11:12, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep Twice world champion recorded in reliable publications. Edit for clarity - my comment refers to Stuart Liddell. Dalliance (talk) 11:42, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Likewise speedy keep per above and WP:MUSBIO 1, 6, 7, 9, 12 (e.g.). These days, many or most of the prominent players in piping scene are not full-time professional (Liddell is though a schools' and private tutor), with those choosing and able to secure a post in the army in some cases but not necessarily of as much or any greater notability than the top non-professionals. Likewise, the most notable bands are predominantly amateur. The awards and bands in question are the very top in the field, internationally, so if not notable, piping as a whole is not. Mutt Lunker (talk) 12:21, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia doesn't have a bias against "amateur" musicians — in actual fact, music is a field where the distinction between "amateur" and "professional" largely isn't a useful one for us to even consider. It's not a field where one needs a license to practice, and while getting a university or college degree in the field certainly can't hurt it isn't a mandatory requirement that one has to undertake before they're allowed to be a musician — so the amateur/professional distinction really just boils down to "are they supporting themselves exclusively on their music alone, or do they still have a day job alongside it?", which is completely irrelevant to WP:NMUSIC. So an article about a musician doesn't live or die on A/P quibbles, but on whether the article contains adequate reliable sourcing to support a credible claim of notability under NMUSIC — and what I see when I look at the articles is that good sourcing is there for Liddell, while Maxwell is parked entirely on primary sources and blurbs. So to me, it's a keep for Liddell, but a delete for Maxwell unless stronger sourcing can be located. Bearcat (talk) 13:45, 9 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep for Liddell, seems like he meets notability easily. Maxwell is tougher - I noticed efforts are being made to improve sources and claim notability since the AFD was posted. Right now, despite the sources, I don't really see a strong notability claim for him (source claims are more about the bands that won that he played in, rather than him as an individual), but I'll reserve judgement on him if further additions are being made. --   R45    talk! 20:35, 9 October 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep for Maxwell too. I have added some references from reliable sources to his article. Maxwell has the notable claim of being the first person in history to have led the drum corps of two different bands to victory the World Pipe Band Championships. So overall he meets WP:MUSICBIO 6, 7 and 9. Drchriswilliams (talk) 22:08, 9 October 2015 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.