Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/The Jihad Foundation Organization in Mesopotamia


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.  

The result was delete. --Core desat 02:57, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

The Jihad Foundation Organization in Mesopotamia

 * – (View AfD) (View log)

Unreferenced, badly-done conspiracy article for al-Qaeda in Iraq built on weasel phrases and hate and extreme distrust of mass media and official statements (appeareantly, all mass media are part of the "corporate media's" disinformation campaign) HanzoHattori 13:33, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

The guy's attitute is: Quote: "The associated press is a huge corporation, they can easily propagate misinformation" (it's Reuters and AFP too, and all major newspapers and TV networks as well).

If you look on his talk page, he was warned several times to stop vandalising al-Qaeda-related articles, but he just did not.--HanzoHattori 13:40, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, and if he reverts the proper AQI article again: it's this one. --HanzoHattori 13:45, 13 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Nuke it from orbit. It's the only way to be sure. Nick mallory 13:54, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * (Speedily) redirect to Al-Qaeda in Iraq (plausible rendition of the group's name), and protect. - Mike Rosoft 14:11, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Strong Keep This is the group's official name. There is no "al-qaeda" in "Tenzheem Qa'adah al-Jihad fi bilad al-Rafidayn." If you want to see a non existant "al-qaeda", go right ahead, but the official name should be used for the title. Those who ask for deletion are motivated by their biased non neutral point of view over FACT. Also this thing is not a vote. - Lft6771
 * I'll thank you not to second guess my motivations, pal. Nick mallory 14:42, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Provide justification for deleting this article, you provided none. So your recommendation is based on your personal point of view. This is not a vote, but contribution of ideas of what should be done based on fact, logic, and reason. -Lft6771 14:53, 13 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Redirect/Merge: per Mike. It's a longstanding naming convention that we call things the names by which they are most popularly known in the English-language world.  You don't see the main article being named "Rhode Island and Providence Plantations," but that is the legal name of the state.    RGTraynor  15:46, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

As of protecting the articles, take a look at this too (very related). "There's-no-al-Qaeda" stuff + bunch of quite unrelated (and misleading: "himself was never Al Qaeda", to quote) stuff on Zarqawi and also the war in whole for some reason. I'm kind of tired of playing with our friend Latuff. --HanzoHattori 16:34, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Btw, I think "TruthSeeker777" may be related to "Lft6771": - he has the same obsession (before his move, there was a page on AQI alright, covering also it's origins as Tawhid) "ThruthSeeker" had the original page renamed to Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad. (Also, it would be nice if someone explained me the mystery of what and from what article did I appearently "COPY AND PASTE" there exactly, because I don't remember anything like that.)
 * Delete as a blatant WP:POVFORK, riddled with original research and unattributed synthesis. If there are reliable sources which dispute the attribution of the name and administration of this group, they may be placed on the existing article page. --Dhartung | Talk 02:24, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
 * This is the original article the other is the POV fork. This is the older article. -Lft6771 16:51, 14 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Delete per Dhartung. It seems that such organization simply does not exist. This article is misleading.Biophys 02:52, 14 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Oh yeah - I just did the google check, and it's true. This name is not used AT ALL. --HanzoHattori 06:48, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Search for the Arabic text version of the name, NOT the english translation. This group does exist and does not call itself "al-Qaeda" but the Arabic version of the title of this page. -Lft6771 16:51, 14 June 2007 (UTC)


 * What are you talking about? This is English Wikipedia. No one ever used this name. In the entire world. Only you. Can't get worse original research than this - it's impossible. --HanzoHattori 17:13, 14 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Delete - POV fork, one and the same organization as Al-Qaeda in Iraq; they should be one article, and this is a POV fork, so there's nothing to merge. The Evil Spartan 17:24, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Changed to Strong delete - per link by Hanzo. The organization name doesn't even exist. At very least, this brutally fails WP:V. The Evil Spartan 17:25, 14 June 2007 (UTC)
 * This article exists at Arabic wikipedia:


 * Should that article be delted? Of course not. That is what this group is called and all content related to it should be added to this article. This article has been in existence since May 14. HanzoHattori began the POV fork on June 12 over a preexisting disambiguation page. -Lft6771 17:59, 14 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Let me guess: you wrote this Arabic article too? "Al-Qaeda in Iraq" search returns 591,000 hits and "al-Qaida in Iraq" further 317,000 (for example, phrase "Al-Qaeda in Iraq claimed" 13,600). Other names (all listed in the article alright) much much less - for example, the Arabic version of "Tanzim Qaidat Al-Jihad fi Bilad al-Rafidayn" only 142, and "Organization of Jihad's Base in the Country of the Two Rivers" (the correct literal translation) only 196. Which is thousands time less. And yours - literally no one, just you and you alone. Latuff: People are telling you how the Wikipedia works, can't you really stop ignoring everyone? Are you unreformable, really? When I tag the article with "citation needed" and "original research", your acts of simply removing all of them won't make this problem go away - you HAVE to provide sources for all your claims when needed. What kind of sources? Listen to what people tell you: yes, the dastardly "corporate media" and such. Same thing about tags, and all other things I'm really tired of telling you by now. --HanzoHattori 18:47, 14 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Delete POV fork. --MichaelLinnear 22:44, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Timeline to show and prove that this page is not a POV fork and that there is no jusftification for this page to be deleted:
 * 24 June 2004: The "Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad" Page Created
 * 19 July 2004: The "Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad" Page is Developed
 * 24 October 2004: The "Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad" Page Before Tenzheem Qa'adah al-Jihad fi Bildad al-Rafydayn (Organization Foundation the Jihad in Lands of the Two Rivers called "al-Qaeda in Iraq" for some reason) Appears
 * 10 December 2004: A picture of a group standing in front of a banner with the words "Tenzheem Qa'adah al-Jihad" (Organization Foundation the Jihad or The Jihad Foundation Organization) is added to the "Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad Page". (New Page is not created for this new group, but content for both began being added to the "Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad" page) Also, the unsourced statement that the group "Jama'at al-Tawhid al-Jihad" has changed its name to "al-Qaeda in Iraq" has been added to article.
 * 23 August 2005: "Jama'at al-Tawhid wal Jihad" article moved to "Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad"
 * 27 September 2005: "Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad" renamed/moved to "al-Qaeda in Iraq" (note: justification for page move is based on an unsourced statement. Content for two groups begins being added to the same article.)
 * 14 May 2007: After the "al-Qaeda in Iraq" (formerly Jama'at al-Tawhid al-Jihad) Page being developed for about two years with content for three different groups being jumbled into the same article, "al-Qaeda in Iraq" Page is moved back to "Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad" with goal of seperating the content into 3 different articles (with 1 new one being created)
 * 14 May 2007: A new page "The Jihad Foundation Organization in Mesopotamia" is created with content taken from the original "Jama'at al-Tawhid wal-Jihad" relevant to the group "Tenzheem Qa'adah al-Jihad fi Bilad al-Rafydayn" ("Organization Foundation the Jihad in Lands of the two rivers" or "The Jihad Foundation Organization in Mesopotamia" and also called "al-Qaeda in Iraq" for some reason which makes no sense to me.)
 * 13 June 2007: HanzoHattori marks the "The Jihad Foundation Organization in Mesopotamia" Page for deletion.
 * 14 May 2007: A disambiguation page for the term "'al-Qaeda' in Iraq" is created for "al-Qaeda" linked or associated groups operating in Iraq.
 * 31 May 2007: The "Al-Qaeda in Iraq (disambiguation)" Page is renamed "Al-Qaeda in Iraq" because the"(disambiguation)" part was considered superfluous.
 * 12 June 2007: HanzoHattori blanks out the "al-Qaeda in Iraq" (disambiguation page) and begins adding content for "Tenzheem Qa'adah al-Jihad fi Bilad al-Rafidayn" ("Organization Foundation the Jihad in Lands of the two rivers" or "The Jihad Foundation Organization in Mesopotamia" and also called "al-Qaeda in Iraq" for some reason which makes no sense to me.) which already has an existing page for it called "The Jihad Foundation Organization in Mesopotamia" which he marks for deletion (the page this AfD is for).

-Lft6771 00:46, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I do believe you have said it yourself up there: this page was created from the content of another page, directly (which is a violation of GFDL). There should only be one article: the original. We can deal with the misuse of the Al-Qaeda in Iraq page separately; don't you agree? The Evil Spartan 01:01, 17 June 2007 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.