Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/The Mary Tyler Moore Show opening sequence


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. No consensus to delete. The issue of merging can be discussed on the article's talk page. (non-admin closure) Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:40, 26 August 2010 (UTC)

The Mary Tyler Moore Show opening sequence

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Intricate summary of opening title sequence from The Mary Tyler Moore Show. Main article already contains a section discussing the opening sequence with a sufficient level of detail.

The Mary Tyler Moore Show opening sequence is also mostly unsourced. The references in the article relate to very little of the actual content, instead discussing a bystander who appeared in a freeze-frame in the opening, the unveiling of a statue of Moore in Minneapolis, and a table in a restaurant appearing in the sequence for a second or two.  Sottolacqua  (talk) 12:51, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Additional Comment—The opening title sequence of this television program does not meet notability guidelines on a level that it should be a stand-alone article, and the article contains little encyclopedic info that could be merged into The Mary Tyler Moore Show. The first page of a Google search returns only links to video/fan sites and places like www.sitcomsonline.com.  Sottolacqua  (talk) 14:06, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Comment— The Simpsons opening sequence is no more notable than Mary Tyler Moore's. Do you believe it should be proposed for deletion as well? Njsustain (talk) 09:09, 20 August 2010 (UTC)


 * Keep or Merge I don't have a problem with the content of the article and for some reason (I hated this show) this is a very famous television item. It is often referenced and mentioned - there are a huge number of hits.  The real question I have is whether this is better suited to be merged into the main Mary Tyler Moore Show.  I would ask the nominating editor on to be more specific on what basis he/she is proposing deletion?  I think this article needs further referencing but that is not a basis for deleting the article.  I would support keeping although I could get behind a thoughtful merge of the article back into the main article.  My only concern would be an WP:UNDUE issue after the merge.  There are already subsidiary articles from the main Mary Tyler Moore Show and I have no issue with this being another such subsidiary article (provided it is cleaned up a little and referenced better). |►  ϋrбan яeneωaℓ  •  TALK  ◄| 13:49, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep The article documents fairly well (with too much fannish detail) the relative notability of this shows opening sequence. The song could probably have its own article, but at least adds notability to the sequence. The statue is a clue: its not just a statue of Moore, its a statue of what she does in the sequence. This article was broken away from the main article after some reasonable discussion on it having undue weight there. It needs better sourcing, and i am fine with the more trivial content being removed after discussion. full disclosure: as a recovering tv addict, I have this sequence and song burned into my memory for all time. i suspect some tens of millions do as well, hence the notability.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 15:41, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Delete per Sottolacqua's reasoning. Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 16:34, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Comment if "notability is the issue I would suggest you look at a small sampling of references to the hat toss I picked out in about 5 seconds just looking on the NYT on the hat toss part of the opening credits:, , , , .  The real question is what content would you propose to delete from the article and how would you propose to re-merge this with the main Mary Tyler Moore Show Article.  I think this is the perfect set up of a more detailed article on a subsection of the main article about the show |►  ϋrбan яeneωaℓ  •  TALK  ◄| 17:14, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Strong Keep This is an extremely notable opening, well recognized, often copied, and discussed in secondary sources. There is a bronze statue at the location of the end of the opening for goodness sake. The theme song has been covered many times and was released as a single. It was taking up quite a bit of space in the MTM Show article and it is totally appropriate to put this verifiable and notable information into its own article. If there is an issue with sources they should be requested--this is a notable topic and lack of sources is not a valid reason to consider deletion, only a reason to request references.Njsustain (talk) 17:35, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Television-related deletion discussions.  -- • Gene93k (talk) 18:38, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep - Very well done article about a well established part of American popular culture. Carrite (talk) 18:53, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep or Merge: No matter what it does need to be kept (even if it is merged with the parent article) but it needs LOTS of sources. -  Neutralhomer •  Talk  • 19:00, 19 August 2010 (UTC)


 * Keep I'd like to point out to those that !voted merge, this article was split from the main article, as per the edit summary of the first edit. Whose Your Guy (talk) 20:03, 19 August 2010 (UTC)


 * Keep -- interesting level of detail that would unbalance the main article if it were returned there. --SarekOfVulcan (talk) 20:08, 19 August 2010 (UTC)


 * Keep per Sarek and Mercurywoodrose. Iconic TV sequence, often discussed on in contemporaneous commentary, sometimes in sociopolitical writing. Hullaballoo Wolfowitz (talk) 00:50, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep. How will this article make it on its own? It's an appropriate topic for a spinoff article: a highly influential sequence, decently sourced, too long to be re-incorporated into the main article. Therefore, in my opinion: It's gonna make it after all. --Arxiloxos (talk) 03:42, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep (Disclaimer: I am the creator of the article, which consists mostly of content split out of the main show article.)  As said a few times already, the reason for having a separate article is to avoid undue weight of the opening sequence discussion in the main show article.  While some unreferenced, fannish content could be removed from the opening sequence content, I think that the amount remaining would still constitute undue weight if put back. -- JTSchreiber (talk) 04:40, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep - There's no earthshaking significance to an opening sequence to a TV show, but this one has inspired a statue that was documented in the NY Times... --Orlady (talk) 18:32, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep per Mercurywoodrose. The article is well-referenced, keeps to NPOV, and is certainly too long to be included in the main article. Besides, it is an iconic TV moment (I remember it vividly, though I saw it 30 years ago). Yoninah (talk) 12:43, 25 August 2010 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.