Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/The Millers


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.  

The result was Keep. Whether this article is kept, merged, or redirected is a debate that can be done outside of AfD. Deathphoenix ʕ 04:35, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

The Millers
Is being a finalist on one reality show (America's Got Talent) enough for an article? I don't think so, but listing here for further comment. NawlinWiki 21:04, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
 * I don't think so either, which is why I tagged it for speedy deletion. Badly fails WP:BAND. Delete VoiceOfReason 21:37, 22 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Delete. No even close to meeting WP:BIO, WP:BAND, WP:ORG or any standard for notability.  -- Satori Son  00:08, 23 September 2006 (UTC) Update comment: Even with the recent improvements, I still do not believe this subject quite meets the notability criteria of WP:BAND.  More importantly, it utterly fails the third-party sources requirement of WP:V.  As I stated below, I would support a Redirect to America's Got Talent (Season 1). -- Satori Son 13:07, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Keep. They were actually runners-up on the finale of America's Got Talent. They placed 2nd or 3rd&mdash;see America's Got Talent (Season 1) for an explanation why there is an ambiguity. I admit, I don't know much about the band apart from their website (which I added to the article) and their appearance on AGT, so I can't do much expansion. But I think the band would be notable enough with at least this background. Tinlinkin 03:58, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Comment: I could support a Redirect to America's Got Talent (Season 1), but I still do not believe that notability is even remotely sufficient to support a stand alone article. -- Satori Son 04:32, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
 * I have expanded the article. It's the best I can do, since I'm not too familiar with band/performer articles in geenral. I believe the Millers have much more TV exposure in the US than with many other bands on WP. And since winners on AGT were determined by audience vote, the band is relatively well-known. There is a whole category of Category:America's Got Talent contestants, and some of them are just as well-known (if not less than) as The Millers. Tinlinkin 05:33, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Keep. Article needs considerable improvements (at least some of which I've agreed to undertake in the coming days) but, by my standards, WP:N is sufficiently&mdash;if barely&mdash;met within to fail WP:CSD. RadioKirk (u|t|c)  18:00, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree that this article does not fall under the speedy delete criteria of CSD, but I'm still not convinced that this AfD discussion should result in keep. My main concern still involves WP:V. I'll try to look back at the article in a day or two and revise my opinion if third-party sources are found. Thanks, Satori Son 23:36, 26 September 2006 (UTC)
 * That closing note was primarily in response to VOR; yes, the article as it stands now borders on Afd-worthy, but it's certainly borderline enough to allow for work. :) RadioKirk (u|t|c)  03:24, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

Okay, two things to say:


 * 1) I was wrong. This article meets WP:BAND; see ninth bullet point, "Has won or placed in a major music competition". The definition of "major music competition" is open to debate, but it's certainly plausible that America's Got Talent (a show with which I am unfamiliar) qualifies. Accordingly I withdraw my vote to delete and vote to keep.
 * 2) If this article didn't meet WP:BAND, I still hold that it would be a candidate for speedy deletion. The fact is that CSD A7 is a joke. I've lost count of how many newly-created articles I've seen that say something like, "Joseph Q. Wikinewbie is the GREATAST PERSON EVAR!!!!1!!", and every single one of them has been speedily deleted under A7. Why? Surely the GREATAST PERSON EVAR is notable, so the article definitely asserts the notability of the subject. But the admins (wisely, IMHO) ignore the rules and speedily delete the articles anyway. The CSD process needs reform.

Sorry for getting on a soapbox, but that's what WP:IAR is all about.

VoiceOfReason 06:08, 27 September 2006 (UTC)


 * If you'll allow me to disagree with your second point&mdash;and herewith remove it from the purview of WP:IAR&mdash;"Joseph Q. Wikinewbie is the GREATAST PERSON EVAR!!!!1!!" does not assert notability; it's my understanding that the data required to back up the assertion is part and parcel of the assertion. :) RadioKirk (u|t|c)  14:22, 27 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Redirect to show.--Peta 04:52, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Keep: If the article's link to the Clayton Miller Blues Band is followed and one clicks 'Press' on the left menu, one finds amongst many mainly local press articles 'The Observer', I read this (as saved on the CMB site). Unless that 'Press' section with its links to press articles does not match actual press articles, the Wikipedia article should be safe as well – though it can be improved. — SomeHuman 3 Oct2006 21:04 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.