Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Trent Meacham


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   delete. I am unconvinced by the arguments that he might pass WP:ATHLETE. Kevin (talk) 21:31, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Trent Meacham

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Fails WP:ATHLETE. No assertion that he plays professionally. Crotchety Old Man (talk) 20:19, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep - he is competing at the highest level of amatuer basketball in the United States. --Dincher (talk) 20:37, 6 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Delete Playing for an NCAA Division I team in any sport is not inherently notable. WP:ATHLETE was changed in order to close out the argument that "the highest amateur level of a sport" means that all college athletes are entitled to their own articles.  Otherwise, we'd have tons of articles about all the players on a particular team (in this case, its Illinois, but I would say the same about Kentucky and North Carolina as well).  The phrase "usually considered to mean the Olympic Games or World Championships" was added to close whatever loophole might be inferred.  In this case, there's an article called 2009-10 Illinois Fighting Illini men's basketball team where all of the player bio stuff can be put. Mandsford (talk) 21:35, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Amatuer basketball not longer participate in the Olympics or World Championships. Those events are now for pros. Dincher (talk) 21:59, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
 * In that case we have to use our judgement to decide whether playing college basketball is equivalent to having played basketball at the Olympics or World Championships when amateurs did so, or whether it is equivalent to competing at that level now in sports where amateurs do take part. The answer looks pretty obvious to me, but I've been flamed before for pointing out the American exceptionalism involved in claiming that North American college athletes are automatically notable, so maybe my opinion doesn't reflect consensus. Would we for a second consider giving an automatic notability pass to college athletes in China or Russia? Phil Bridger (talk) 20:46, 7 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Delete. Falls afoul of WP:ATHLETE. -- Dennis The Tiger   (Rawr and stuff) 22:32, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
 * A foul? If Meacham gets four more of those, he has to leave the game! Mandsford (talk) 23:02, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Quite punny of you, Mandsford! =) --71.227.178.136 (talk) 22:37, 8 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Keep Significant third party coverage. The change in WP:ATHLETE was likely meant to mean that small college players who came off the bench were not automatically granted articles. Meacham is a starter for a major program. -Drdisque (talk) 20:00, 7 October 2009 (UTC)
 * If some sources can be cited to show significant coverage (such as an article about Meacham in SI, or at least the press outside of Fighting Illini Country, and I haven't seen any), then he would qualify under WP:N. As far as what the changes in WP:ATHLETE were intended to accomplish, there were long discussions about it Wikipedia talk:Notability (people)/Archive 2009, and although there are some who feel that WP:ATHLETE should be written to make exceptions for starters or major college programs, there haven't been additional changes.  Considering all the persons who have ever started an NCAA Division I college basketball game, even that type of rule would result in a lot of articles created by fans.  Wikipedia sets a really low bar for sports and entertainment articles anyway, so every season of every college program gets its own article and any fan can create their own personal game program within the space limits.  We don't need to go even lower. Mandsford (talk) 21:18, 7 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Delete Misses the WP:ATHLETE sieve, and does not appear to have received independent in depth coverage in any other arena. - 2/0 (cont.) 21:22, 12 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Delete - what 2/0 said. JohnWBarber (talk) 23:46, 12 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Delete Fails WP:ATHLETE. Highest amateur competition in basketball would at the very least by an international competition such as the Olympics.  Grsz 11  04:33, 13 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep The main argument for deletion is incorrect. Meacham has graduated from college, and is now playing professionally in Austria:, . Austria isn't exactly a basketball hotspot, but it's something. I've also added a couple of refs pertaining to his college career. Zagalejo^^^ 08:20, 13 October 2009 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.