Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Turkmen Armenia


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete.  Sandstein  09:44, 27 November 2016 (UTC)

Turkmen Armenia

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Its content that is directly related to the subject is all unsourced and the overall content seems to be OR synthesis. The term "Turkmen Armenia" (or "Turkoman Armenia") appears to be not used in RS sources dealing with the history of Armenia. The history detailed in the article is already covered in other articles such as Kara Koyunlu and Ak Koyunlu. The article appears to be OR, created to explain why the word "Turcomania" appears near to, or in some cases replaces, "Armenia" on some European maps published in the 17th and 18th centuries. That itself is an interesting issue, but personally I have never seen any published explanation for the term's usage on these maps. The real Turkomania, aka Turkmenia, now called Turkmenistan, is a completely different entity in a completely different part of the world. For this article to exist, sources have to exist that use the specific phrase "Turkmen Armenia".Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 19:35, 12 November 2016 (UTC)
 * Clarification. Looking back at the article's history, its creator says that it was created because "To better organize the history of Armenia, a page for the Turkmen period is required". So the phrase "Turkmen Armenia" is probably derived from those maps mentioned, rather than the article created to explain them. There is a gap in Wikipedia's direct coverage of Armenia's history during the periods covered by this article (setting aside its indirect coverage in articles like Kara Koyunlu and Ak Koyunlu). However, the article's title is not one used in RS sources and the grouping together all of the history of Armenia during the periods covered by this article seems to be not one followed in RS sources. So the OR synthesis argument for deletion remains unless an alternative title that is legitimate can be suggested. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 16:04, 14 November 2016 (UTC)

comment What do you think of Seljuq Armenia? Perhaps it's not related since its a spin off the Seljuq Empire article, but this Turkmen Armenia concept could be worded differently. Perhaps Armenia under Turkic rule? Still seems vague and OR. I'm not sure who came up with these vague concepts. It's a bit like saying Turkish Greece. There is a Spanish version of this concept called Al-Andalus, but I don't really know what the Turkic tribes called Armenia back then. Would be interesting to research. If it wasn't Armenia (I would assume it wasn't), then I'd support deleting this OR article and merging the information into either Aq Koyunlu et al., or a new article with the name they actually used back then if any particular as of yet unmentioned Turkic name was used for the region. --92slim (talk) 03:58, 17 November 2016 (UTC)
 * I thing Seljuq Armenia is another possible AfD. Perhaps even more so than this article. The Seljuks ruled almost nothing in Armenia - whatever they had captured they very quickly either gave away to local allies, sold, lost, or just walked away from. The Saltukids, Shah-Armens, Shaddadids, etc., were not Seljuks, nor did they even have territory that abutted Seljuk territory. But there is a gap in the history of Armenia that needs filling. Maybe an article with just a time period title. Tiptoethrutheminefield (talk) 21:16, 20 November 2016 (UTC)
 * I have found another one: Mongol Armenia. I agree, all these are potentially OR articles that should be nominated for deletion. I'm putting up my vote. --92slim (talk) 10:40, 22 November 2016 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America1000 01:02, 19 November 2016 (UTC)

Delete - Article has been little better than a stub for years, has only one source that doesn't call the article by name, and provides no additional information that several similar articles already provide. --Nucdian (talk) 01:43, 22 November 2016 (UTC)

Delete - Per discussion above. --92slim (talk) 10:41, 22 November 2016 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple (talk) 07:55, 22 November 2016 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Armenia-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple (talk) 07:55, 22 November 2016 (UTC)


 * Delete as OR / SYNTH. K.e.coffman (talk) 01:12, 23 November 2016 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.