Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Underwood, Ontario


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   no consensus. There seem to be a number of possible outcomes here, especially as there are two possible communities referred to. Best to close this as NC for the time being to allow further discussion to continue without precluding a further AfD in the future. Black Kite (t) (c) 00:44, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

Underwood, Ontario

 * – ( View AfD View log  •  )

No references, a population of 100? And is considered part of another community Whenaxis (talk) 22:49, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep Not sure - Population centers are inherently notable and this appears to be one  Having a population of 100 is not a reason to delete an article of a town/village.  Many have far less and are still inherently notable.  If it was population 50, I'd still vote keep.--Oakshade (talk) 23:03, 7 April 2010 (UTC) Whoops!.  It seems this article is referring to a different Underwood in Ontario.  Right now I can't find any info on it.--Oakshade (talk) 23:13, 7 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Ontario-related deletion discussions.  -- • Gene93k (talk) 02:08, 8 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Comment. This seems to be an article about two different places. The first two paragraphs deal with what appears to be a neighborhood or housing development in Markham; the last paragraph, with a hamlet that forms part of the municipality of Kincardine. Although the article originally dealt with only the first one, I'm unsure of that one's notability: I can't find mentions of it anywhere except in real-estate sites, and if it's just a subdivision (housing estate), there's a pretty strong AfD tradition of rejecting such places as nonnotable. (The complete lack of relevant Google News hits suggests that it's not a place whose name has "verifiable widespread usage".) The second place, however—which is the one that appears in the Google map linked by Oakshade above—seems to meet our usual requirements for verifiable populated places; it had a separate existence before being incorporated in the municipality in 1999, and there are some sources (for example, this) that could be used to support at least a stub on it. My opinion at the moment is that the article should be kept and rewritten so that its topic is the Kincardine place, but I'd like to hear from someone who is familiar with Markham and can clarify the nature of the Underwood there. Deor (talk) 12:48, 8 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Delete The intersection of Steeles Avenue and Birchmount Road doesn't appear to be a unique community.  I can't tell where the name "Underwood, Ontario" would have come from ; there's an "Underwood Carpet Cleaning" but it isn't anywhere close to the intersection.  Although Wikipedia is very generous when it comes to populated communities, there's a tendency for people to want to write about their own neighborhood separately from the community in which they live.  Mandsford (talk) 13:14, 8 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Comment - The reason why I nominated this article is because I live in Markham, and I've never heard of this community before. I nominated Legacy, Markham, Ontario for AfD because it has no notable areas that I know of. I'm very familiar with the Markham area - and I believe that Underwood (in Markham) should actually be part of the community Milliken. We could also rewrite it so its about the community in Kincardine. Whenaxis (talk) 22:54, 8 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Comment - simply "not hearing of this community before" is not a verifiable source of information and not grounds for deletion.--Nyuarsx (talk) 23:19, 8 April 2010 (UTC)
 * So, if the article was created on nothing more than that the author claimed to have heard of this place, that is a verifiable source of information? Nevertheless, even if the burden of proof was on us, I think it's pretty clear that we've proven that there is no Underwood at the corner of Birchmount and Steeles.  Mandsford (talk) 02:58, 9 April 2010 (UTC)
 * To make the accusation that I was trying to make a formal fallacy by denying the antecedent is both inappropriate and absurd. See WP:Civility --Nyuarsx (talk) 05:38, 9 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Perhaps you should look at it as well. The suggestion that the nomination was made on the grounds of "Simply 'not hearing of this community before'" was what most people would consider to be an attempt at sarcasm.  The basis for his nomination was that there were no references and that the article was describing part of another community.   Mandsford (talk) 13:03, 9 April 2010 (UTC)
 * That is a direct quotation of the the nominating editor's reason why (with why emphasized in italic): "The reason why I nominated this article is because I live in Markham, and I've never heard of this community before." Making my statement obviously not sarcasm but a direct response to the reasoning of the AfD.  --Nyuarsx (talk) 01:04, 12 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Selectively Merge as part of the greater undisputed community that it resides. --Nyuarsx (talk) 23:19, 8 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Merge Just merge and redirect to the appropriate article.  Mr. C.C. Hey yo!I didn't do it! 18:33, 9 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep as an article about the hamlet in the Municipality of Kinkardine. If anyone wants to merge any sourceable information about the other place into Milliken, Ontario or Markham, Ontario, it will be available in the article's history. Deor (talk) 19:29, 9 April 2010 (UTC)
 * The article would need a rewrite, but you're right, there is what looks like an unincorporated (but populated) community by that name, on Highway 21, northast of Kincardine. Unfortunately, I can't transmit the street view, but the signs marking Underwood are very clear.  That would be a keeper.    Mandsford (talk) 20:54, 9 April 2010 (UTC)


 * So everyone agrees to rewrite the article and merge the information of Underwood, Markham into Markham or Milliken. Rewriting the article into the hamlet northeast of Kincardine. Whenaxis (talk) 22:09, 9 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Comment I found a viable map for the Underwood near Kincardine: 1 just wait for the street view to come in (usually a copuple of seconds) Whenaxis (talk) 22:18, 9 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep both Underwoods. The Geographical Names Board of Canada has listings for both. This may be another case of "once notable, always notable", referring to an agricultural community that existed before the IBM golf course was built. You can use this form to check a Canadian place name. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 23:13, 9 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Eastmain where in the article or in the Geographical Names Board of Canada does it state there was an IBM Golf Course? Whenaxis (talk) 20:21, 10 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Merge to Milliken, Ontario, since it is considered to be part of Milliken. Dew Kane (talk) 04:08, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep per Eastmain. Outback the koala (talk) 07:58, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.