Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/University of Miami School of Business Administration


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. Cirt (talk) 00:23, 10 February 2010 (UTC)

University of Miami School of Business Administration

 * – ( View AfD View log  •  )

While was going through a GA review,  decided that based on the feedback he received, the UM Business School required its own article based on the fact that a chunk of the UM article focused on magazine rankings stating that the UM Business School was #X amongst other business schools. I redirected it back to the main UM a total of 3 times, but Racepacket continues to undo my redirect and say that "[I] should not delete the page, if [I] want it gone [I] should send it to AFD". So here I am.

Of the various references utilized for the article, 11 of them are published by the Business School (located on the Business School's website). Another four are "UM's Business School is #X according to this magazine" references. The other references are two non-trivial mentions in news papers and another is a reference at GradSchools.com to show that you are awarded an MBA by graduating from UM's Business School.

Compared to the other divisions of the University of Miami, I don't find this one any more notable than say the College of Arts & Sciences (the largest at UM), the School of Communication, or the Frost School of Music (which has an article that I have no opinion on, but should probably go too).

All in all, the Business School is just a building on the UM campus that only has a page on Wikipedia because Racepacket has it in his mind that the main University of Miami article must be promoted to GA through any means possible because there is no WikiProject for the University to organize such an endeavor. The forking of content is certainly not necessary, especially when the article reads like an advertisement (the "boosterism" that Racepacket has been saying he is trying to avoid).— Ryūlóng ( 竜龙 ) 21:09, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Schools-related deletion discussions.  -- – Spaceman  Spiff  21:27, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Education-related deletion discussions.  -- – Spaceman  Spiff  21:27, 3 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Comment. GA considerations aside, would the school merit mention in the main U of Miami article? I haven't looked at the references, but a high ranking among similar schools would indicate some moderate notability, particularly if that ranking is sustained over some years. I'm loathe to cite WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS, but it may be instructive to look at similar collegiate business schools at similar universities, to see if they have articles, and - if so - to see what sources they draw on for notability. There might be some low-hanging fruit we're missing. I concur, though, that the article seems to veer a bit toward promotion, and that we do need independent sources before keeping it. UltraExactZZ Said~ Did 21:30, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
 * The only schools that have any sort of other mention in the main UMiami article are the Med School and RSMAS, both of which have their own campuses elsewhere in Miami-Dade. The only reason the Business School had any sort of extensive coverage in the main article was due to the magazine rankings. I've removed that section (and another that focused on the rest of the divisions) to leave just a section on the U as a whole.— Ryūlóng ( 竜龙 ) 21:33, 3 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Actually, the other units of University of Miami with separate articles are:1) law, 2) music school, 3) med school, and 4) RSMAS.  There are also dozens of separate articles about the various University varsity sports teams and their individual seasons. See Category:University of Miami Racepacket (talk) 02:37, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * College sports and college divisions are apples and oranges. But, I did not forget the Law School and Music School. I stated that the only other divisions that are elaborated upon in the main article are RSMAS and the Med School because they have their own separate campuses. The Music School and the Law School do not, but they have their own articles. The Business School did not have an article until you interpreted the GA Reviewer's statement about the focus on the rankings concerning the Business School.— Ryūlóng  ( 竜龙 ) 03:19, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * It is true that the Campus section of the article has separate subsections for the Medical campus and the Virginia Key campus, but that is a description of the campuses not the academic programs. All academic units are listed in the Organization section of the main article (with links to the four separate articles covering individual academic units.) Racepacket (talk) 13:32, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep - The article offers a number of independent sources which establish notability. The article is well-sourced and far exceeds anything which preexisted in the University of Miami main article as of the start of this week.  As it is, this article has 15,192 bytes and the main University of Miami article has 64,111 bytes so merging the two articles would create an excessively long article.  WP:SIZERULE. Quite frankly, I don't understand Ryulong's basis for this AfD. 1) Many business schools have an article separate from the main university article. They are listed in List of United States graduate business school rankings and  Category:Business schools in the United States. 2) I don't think that the article is Boosterism, it is a neutral description of the different degree program offered, but I accept input from other editors on this point.  3) Breaking apart the Business School from the main university article is not "forking" because the two articles do not have different POVs. But none of these grounds are relevant to the AfD -- the question here is whether the UM School of Business Administration is notable.  The cited sources demonstrate that it is. Racepacket (talk) 02:28, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * There is no size issue here. The fact is that the Business School is not notable on its own. The Med School, the Law School, and RSMAS are because they are effectively separate entities from UMiami and (until RSMAS took over the undergrad MSC dept.) all solely doctorate awarding schools. I honestly think that if you're going to make an article on the Business School, there should probably be articles on Arts & Sciences, Architecture, Communication, Nursing, etc. However, there aren't because it wasn't pointed out to you by the GA Reviewer, which is the only reason that there is now an article on the Business School.— Ryūlóng ( 竜龙 ) 03:28, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * The Business School, the Law School, the Medical School, RSMAS and all of the others are separate, co-equal academic units within the University. It is incorrect to state that the Business School "is just a building."  People make their careers teaching and researching there, and the school offers MBAs and Master Degrees in Accounting.  It also has joint degree programs with the Med School and the Law School. Racepacket (talk) 13:32, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Why did you not bother with writing articles on any of the other co-equal academic units of the University of Miami? It's just because someone at the GA review said that the UMiami article focused a lot on the business school.— Ryūlóng ( 竜龙 ) 21:41, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Motives and priority in writing articles are not relevant at AfD. I worked on the Law, Medical School, and RSMAS articles, but did not yet get to Frost or to the 7 missing school. This school is comparable in notability to any of the others listed in List of United States graduate business school rankings. Racepacket (talk) 02:34, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep   We can have articles on individual colleges of this sort, if they are sufficiently important within an important university. From the university website, the school has 2,000 among the 10,000 total undergraduates at the university, 500 among the 5,000 graduate students. That's sufficiently important. (that info should of course go in the article--I got it from the University Website     DGG ( talk ) 06:11, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Incorporated enrollment data. Thanks. Racepacket (talk) 13:42, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep The article is about a notable school and the split makes perfect sense from a size standpoint. Alansohn (talk) 18:40, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep (Notwithstanding issues that may exist with this particular article.) Business schools tend to have identities semi-independent of their universities, and most major U.S. business schools now are the subjects of articles separate from the university articles. I don't see anything about this particular school that justifies merging it into the university article when its peers are covered in separate articles. --Orlady (talk) 22:23, 6 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep - notable b-school. Nominator's motives are suspect.  Rklawton (talk) 07:09, 8 February 2010 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.