Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Violet Myers


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Adequate participation has occurred herein, but no consensus has emerged for a particular outcome regarding this article. The potential for a merge can be further discussed on an article talk page if desired. North America1000 18:51, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Violet Myers

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Unlike some others in her family, not notable. Her career apparently consisted of a few performances only  DGG ( talk ) 19:31, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of England-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 00:45, 10 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 00:45, 10 April 2015 (UTC)
 * I was about to say redirect to Winston Churchill upon seeing the name but don't see any instance of him. I would say redirect but not sure to who. Wgolf (talk) 20:13, 10 April 2015 (UTC)


 * Delete per nom, does not appear to be anything significant about her. Primefac (talk) 10:21, 11 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep - lots and lots of sources in the British Newspaper Archive, some of them WP:ROUTINE but I think when you put them altogether you can spin an article out of it. I've added two prominent ones. Even then, WP:BIO says close family members of notable people should generally be redirected, but we can't do that here because multiple members of her family are notable, so keeping is the only option left. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont)  17:59, 11 April 2015 (UTC)
 * the articles appear to be notices or reviews of a single concert. That does not meet WP:CREATIVE.  DGG ( talk ) 01:31, 15 April 2015 (UTC)
 * I've seen this debate before, where you have small mentions in many many sources that make it possible (albeit difficult) to show notability - usually ends in a "no consensus" close. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont)  07:36, 15 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Yes, I've seen it before. It does not conform to either logic or common sense, or even to the GNG, which says significant coverage.  Put simply, I would say that to be notable you have to have done something notable. Otherwise we're using the GNG like a particularly unintelligent robot, and should devise a program to scrape the internet and enter everyone who has been mentioned twice. (or three times if you want to be particularly selective).  DGG ( talk ) 16:33, 16 April 2015 (UTC)
 * I would certainly agree with that sentiment if it was the only rationale put forward to keeping the article. It's an argument I've used myself for deleting an article (eg: here) and as I said above, some - actually quite a lot - of the coverage is WP:ROUTINE. But for me the salient point is an ambiguous redirect. I'd be happy compromising with a redirect if somebody can suggest precisely where. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont)  09:04, 17 April 2015 (UTC)


 * Keep Seems a clear cut keep.♦ Dr. Blofeld  11:15, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep-Per above. Wgolf (talk) 19:19, 12 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Abstain As originator of this article it would be inappropriate for me to vote on this discussion, but I would like to add some comments. As the originator of about 15 Wikipedia articles on people I am familiar with different interpretations of notability by different editors. Having studied the Wikipedia criteria on notability it is my understanding that it is not the person’s notability per se, but the provision of independent verifiable references to support the article, and I believe I have provided this. For someone who was active more than a hundred years ago, it can be difficult to find many references on the Internet as many documents may not yet be digitised and in the public domain. When I first researched her I knew that she was less notable than her brother and sister, for whom I have created articles, but my research uncovered enough material to start an article on her. Wikipedia works on the principle that nobody knows everything but everybody knows something and it is my hope that other Wikipedians with additional information will contribute to this article in the future. Ritchie333</b> has already added the sentence: She performed classical concerts around the UK during the early 20th century[5] and was described as "possessed of a beautiful soprano voice".[6] and provided two further references to her singing career, for which I am most grateful. <b style="color:#7F007F">Ritchie333</b> states that there are lots and lots of sources in the British Newspaper Archive, so I hope more contributions will follow. DGG has mentioned redirecting to, say Winston Churchill, but her husband was not related. For more information on this see article on her son, Peter Churchill. MrArmstrong2 (talk) 08:19, 16 April 2015 (UTC)
 * It was Wgolf who suggested that redirect. I don't think even a redirect is warranted.  DGG ( talk ) 16:33, 16 April 2015 (UTC)

<div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached. Relisting comment: It would be lovely if users discussed the quality and quantity of the sources so we can close against policy Spartaz Humbug! 06:55, 17 April 2015 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Spartaz Humbug! 06:55, 17 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Delete. As for her performances, all I'm seeing is that her alma mater says she performed at Court Theatre, but was she a star, or was her role similar to what she did for Electra (according to another reference), just being part of the chorus? Other sources just mention her in passing. Nothing substantial. Clarityfiend (talk) 09:12, 17 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Delete, a bombardment of low quality sources or routine coverage does not add up to the sort of good quality coverage we need to write a comprehensive biography. Lankiveil (speak to me) 02:05, 18 April 2015 (UTC).
 * I would suggest merging with her husband's article. The only thing the sources outside of Cambridge, which while reliable doesn't really establish notability, seem to say is that she was a singer.  Yes, there are many of them but they don't add up to much when none of them have any details beyond she sung at X on date Y.  She has other notable relatives, of course, but her husband's page seems to be the most natural target for a merge.  Pinging  who accepted this at AfC for input. --ThaddeusB (talk) 04:48, 18 April 2015 (UTC)
 * I have added some further references to her singing career, which may help the discussion.MrArmstrong2 (talk) 11:41, 20 April 2015 (UTC)
 * Merge to William Algernon Churchill. But if there is no consensus for a merge then keep but not delete. As the spouse of a notable person about whom there is sourced material available a merge is permitted by Notability (people) but I see no policy basis to delete; WP:BEFORE is also relevant. Though I am not convinced that Myers is separately notable, she is of sufficient significance that encyclopaedic coverage of an important family would be damaged by outright deletion. Just Chilling (talk) 19:23, 20 April 2015 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.