Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Vladimir Glebov


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   Keep. Nominator withdraws AFD Pocopocopocopoco (talk) 02:09, 3 February 2009 (UTC)

Vladimir Glebov

 * ( [ delete] ) – (View AfD) (View log)

I am currently workig on List of Heroes of the Russian Federation and I can find absolutely zero references to Glebov having received the Hero of Russia award, on various websites, in ukaz databases and the like. Considering this information was added by User:HanzoHattori a banned user who repeatedly comes back with socks, the veracity of the claims have to be doubted, particularly as nothing can be found which confirms this person's claim of notability. Russavia Dialogue 18:33, 31 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Speedy keep without prejudice. The nomination does not contain a valid reason for deletion, apparently being based on an argumentum ad hominem instead -- this article was created by that person, therefore it is bad.
 * The merits of the nomination can only be considered when a proper reason for deletion is offered. And by the way, not having received that particular award does not imply non-notability, either.  He could be notable for other reasons -- but again, the nomination says nothing about it. ΔιγουρενΕμπρος! 20:32, 31 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Speedy keep. In my book a possible mistake in the text and the nominator's personal dislike of the author are not valid reasons for deletion. HanzoHattori was banned for incivility and not for hoaxes, this is totally irrelevant here. Shame on the nominator. The subject is notable, certainly not a hoax. Sources:, , , to name a few. Colchicum (talk) 20:36, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Speedy keep, per Colchicum. Martintg (talk) 20:58, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Speedy Delete per WP:BAN, and WP:BIO. No prejudice if its recreated with sources. Pocopocopocopoco (talk) 22:47, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
 * How does WP:BAN apply here? The article was created with sources in September 2007, when HanzoHattori wasn't banned. If I am misinterpreting WP:BIO, I promise that when you get banned I'll make sure that the contributions you have made be deleted. Colchicum (talk) 23:01, 31 January 2009 (UTC)
 * "A banned user who evades a ban, may have all of their edits reverted without question (with the exceptions listed here). Any pages that they create may be deleted on sight, per WP:CSD (though care should be taken if other editors have made good-faith edits to the page or its talk page)" the policy states "all their edits reverted" HanzoHattori did try to evade his ban using User:Captain_Obvious_and_his_crime-fighting_dog so all his edits can be reverted. Plus, the article is completely unsourced. By the way, what exactly do you mean by "when you get banned"? Pocopocopocopoco (talk) 03:21, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * The page was not created in defiance of a banm if was created long before any ban. In 2007 HanzoHattori was an editor in much better standing than yourself (and IMHO he still is). The article is not completely unsourced, it is sourced better than 99% of Wikipedia stubs, even after your "cleanup". Colchicum (talk) 10:37, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * But if anything, we certainly have to delete 2008 South Ossetia war, which was started by a sock of M.V.E.i. in defiance of his ban. Colchicum (talk) 11:15, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * 2008 South Ossetia war was written by many different authors so its not a good comparison to this article which was written primarily by HanzoHattori. Also, I don't know who you are and I don't recall interacting with you in any way so I am truly puzzled by your hostile behaviour with commments you've made such as "When you get banned" and claiming that a banned user is in better standing then myself. Pocopocopocopoco (talk) 02:00, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

Further reasoning and response to Colchicum. Yuri Budanov is verified as having received the state award, and it is also verified that he had it stripped from him. There is no evidence as to Glebov ever having received it in the first place, except for a think-tank which is quite possibly misquoting RG. The photo at this article doesn't show the Gold Star, and the text mentions only the red star and order for courage being awarded. The only verifiable fact in the WP article is that he was a military official and he was a "suspect". There is a major WP:BLP issue here. If all him being notable for is being a suspected criminal, and only this fact is verified, the BLP issue alone warrants that this article be deleted, and I am almost inclined to approach an admin to have it speedied. This does not mean that I am not against the creation of a well-sourced notable article in the future, but until such time as that it done, being in the army (is not notable) and being a criminal suspect and that's all the article can say about him (is BLP), the article should actually be speedily deleted. --Russavia Dialogue 15:39, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Living people-related deletion discussions. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 00:01, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep. This is a notable person who was described in many publications, as one can see from the refs in article. All Heroes of Russian Federation are probably notable as people who received the highest honor of their country.Biophys (talk) 04:02, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Out of the four sources, one is a dead link that was already there. The next two don't look reliable. The 4th was already there as an external link and it should remain as an external link as it seems like further reading but doesn't provide a source as to what is written in the article. Pocopocopocopoco (talk) 04:58, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * PBS is reliable enough, just as Russian sources, like "Three wars by colonel Glebov". If you have concerns, please ask at WP:RS noticeboard.Biophys (talk) 05:34, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep I don't see anything wrong with the article. It didn't take much to fix the allegedly "dead" Jamestown link, I do wish people would take the two minutes to fix rather than tag and contend perfectly valid reputable sources are broken. PetersV     TALK 05:50, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Comment Will people stop accusing me of wanting to delete things because I don't like them, because that is an ultimate demonstration of lack of good faith on your parts. I am here to help build an encyclopaedia, not to engage in advocacy of nutcase theories, and in general just hateful, spiteful things. The Jamestown source is incorrect. I can find absolutely ZERO sources which indicate that Glebov had ever been awarded as a Hero of the Russian Federation. This award is bestowed upon the person by way of Ukaz from the President of Russia. Due to it being an Ukaz, it is released out into the public arena. As one can see from List of Heroes of the Russian Federation, a list which I am developing on my own (with some help from other editors in developing articles), one can see that these Ukaz are available from a wide variety of sources, including the dates, the ukaz number, and even the text of the Ukaz. After doing searches in both English and on Runet I can find no other information which verify Jamestown's claim. Due to this information being inserted into the article by the foul-mouthed editor HanzoHattori (who is still defended by numerous editors to this day), and due to his repeated sock-puppeting, there is ZERO reason to WP:AGF with anything that this editor has done in the past. Now Jamestown claims that RG said that he received the award, there is no other evidence of this from Russian sources, including RG itself. Are we assume that somehow ALL Russian sources have removed all traces of this information? For we all know that everyone in Russia is in the employ of state security services, so of course that must be it. But there are enough Russian nuttery sources which can source this information, NG, grani, etc, so they would have info on it, but they don't. --Russavia Dialogue 12:23, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * RG archives from 2001 is mostly not online. HanzoHattori has never created hoaxes. He was banned specifically for incivility, there is ZERO reason to assume bad faith with anything other he has done. The subject's notability, however, stems not only from this alleged award, and AfD is not a proper venue to correct mistakes. Colchicum (talk) 15:02, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions.   -- • Gene93k (talk) 23:09, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Russia-related deletion discussions.   -- Russavia Dialogue 00:16, 2 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep: Him not having had the Hero of Russia award is not a violation of WP:BLP and even if it is you could just remove that information instead of trying to get the page deleted. On a side-note, there's nothing surprising with "Hero's of the Russian Federation" awards given out to war criminals. I can count a large amount of such cases happening in the past 15 years. There's more information on this person and his actions, and this article can be expanded. Grey Fox (talk) 01:12, 2 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Comment No, it is not a violation of WP:BLP, but having an article which only states that he is a suspected criminal is WP:BLP. That's the difference. And if anyone here is like me and can read and understand English, I have clearly stated that I am not against an article if and when sources are provided which give this BLP notability aside from being a suspected criminal, that is a major WP:BLP violation in itself. Russavia Dialogue 01:58, 2 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Comment, This discussion of the need to delete the article because banned user HanzoHattori created it is totally surreal, you only need to check the edit history to find that this article was created by Zscout370 and the second and third edits where done by Alex Bakharev and Irpen. Note also that this article has now been edited by many other editors since Hanzo was banned, so any change he may had made has long been absorbed by subsequent edits. Martintg (talk) 02:36, 2 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Very Weak Keep - I have expanded and NPOVed the article a little bit. Marginally notable individual, much less notable then Budanov. Still his partisipation in the Battle of Grozny might be notable as well as his alleged military crimes (if any reliable info can be provided) Alex Bakharev (talk) 11:54, 2 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Withdraw Based upon Alex's expansion, and as the article no longer accuses the BLP of being a war criminal without sources, he is now marginally notable - not fully but marginally - and as it is not possible for me to change my own opinion to "weak keep", I am withdrawing on that basis. If accusations of war crimes are included, they need to be sourced, otherwise I will remove them without hesitation, WP:3RR or not. --Russavia Dialogue 14:33, 2 February 2009 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.