Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Westfield Mission Valley (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Consensus is that the article, while needing improvement, does pass the notability guidelines. Davewild (talk) 07:08, 19 July 2015 (UTC)

Westfield Mission Valley
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I want a TNT, due to the fact that it's probably not notable, and the current article was written by conflicted editors and has 0 encyclopedic value. My solution would be to redirect the page to Westfield Group until such a time that a neutral tone article showing notability has been created. I was bold and tried to do this, but got reverted. Joseph2302 (talk) 23:23, 11 July 2015 (UTC)


 * delete just corporate spam, fails WP:ORG Jytdog (talk) 23:45, 11 July 2015 (UTC)
 * RESTORE CONTENT THAT WAS DELETED This is a major mall in the city. It has been the focus of extreme media coverage. Now the article can't even be improved upon or have citations added since the article has been fully locked. Removing all of the content while a AFD is ongoing to make the article look less notable is a major good faith violation.-- JOJ Hutton  01:38, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep, clearly notable, plenty of hits in GNews, GBooks, GScholar, and HighBeam. Nominator should do WP:BEFORE. The fact that there may have been a COI problem does not mean you delete every article as a knee-jerk reaction. GregJackP   Boomer!   02:11, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the Article Rescue Squadron's list of content for rescue consideration. GregJackP   Boomer!   02:11, 12 July 2015 (UTC)


 * Keep. Clearly notable. Further, verifiable content should be cited, not deleted. - Wikidemon (talk) 03:19, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Delete I'm not seeing in depth coverage in independent sources. Stuartyeates (talk) 03:35, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Then you are either not looking sufficiently well or defining "independent" in a non-standard way. Carrite (talk) 18:13, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Shopping malls-related deletion discussions. North America1000 06:44, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of California-related deletion discussions. North America1000 06:44, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Business-related deletion discussions. North America1000 06:44, 12 July 2015 (UTC)


 * Comment - First off, it is complete bullshit to lock down the gutted version of this article ahead of an AfD. Material deleted may have been unsourced, but it was uncontroversial and not necessarily wrong, and it is utterly impossible to improve the article at AfD in this state. This is absolutely a violation of the spirit of AfD and a classic example of the abuse of administrative tools to settle a content matter. Full protection should immediately be lifted and content restored for the duration of this debate. Carrite (talk) 17:53, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep - For much of the developed world malls are the downtown shopping areas of today. We treat towns with kid gloves but here we are intent upon using a steamroller, largely because of the activities of anti-COI partisans. Well, guess what, this shopping mall passes our general notability guideline for having been dealt with substantially in multiple, independently published sources of presumed reliability. HERE is coverage of an art installation at the mall by the San Diego Cultural Arts Alliance via KPBS. And MORE on that project via Pomerado News. And THIS IS the San Diego Union-Times, reporting extensively and substantially on a mall expansion in 2008, noting that this facility has been in place since the John F. Kennedy administration. And HERE is coverage of Mission Valley Center in the "Mall Hall of Fame." This article cites other works as sources (deadlinks, unfortunately), including www.history.sandiego.edu/ and Mitch Glaser's "Paradox Unbound" via history.sandiego.edu/ and Libby Brydolf's "Mission Valley's Transformation" (1998), via www.sandiegometro.com/ And so on and on and on by anybody willing to follow WP:BEFORE and actually search the internet for sources. Carrite (talk) 18:11, 12 July 2015 (UTC)
 * It doesn't count towards GNG, but HERE'S a photo of the mall at opening day in March 1961 — over half a century ago. And AGAIN the San Diego Union-Tribune talking about the 1958 decision to authorize the mall, regarded as a seminal event in local history. COVERAGE of a temporary skating rink and Mission Valley Mall from Mission Valley News. And SAN DIEGO TRIBUNE covering the Mall as a party in a lawsuit over a shooting there which I have not mentioned previously. The number of news stories in the San Diego press between 1958 and launch in 1961 are no doubt substantial. And on and on... I've gotta go to work. Carrite (talk) 18:35, 12 July 2015 (UTC)


 * Keep. Clearly passes GNG, but cool to essentially blank it before nominating. Not that the edit history is clean, as there's definitely COI edits in the past, but that does not negate the notability of the subject. oknazevad (talk) 18:58, 13 July 2015 (UTC)
 * Keep, the sources appear to be there, per User:Carrite, but that is not at all an endorsement of the current state of the article. Lankiveil (speak to me) 03:06, 19 July 2015 (UTC).


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.