Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/White Council


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete and redirect to Gandalf. RL0919 (talk) 03:02, 2 December 2019 (UTC)

White Council

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

Fictional organization. No indication it passes WP:NFICTION/WP:GNG. Pure WP:PLOT. BEFORE fails to find any discussion that's not in passing and goes beyond plot summary. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 02:54, 25 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Fictional elements-related deletion discussions. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here  02:54, 25 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Fantasy-related deletion discussions. Necrothesp (talk) 09:36, 25 November 2019 (UTC)


 * Delete — "The White Council" is mentioned in The Hobbit and used (as Tolkien himself said) as a plot device to explain why Gandalf has left Thorin's company to their own devises. Tolkien does not bring the idea in The Lord of the Rings. Fictional references to the Council are pretty scanty, even though it is supposes to be important. If it needs a redirect, redirect to The Hobbit.--Jack Upland (talk) 03:58, 26 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Actually, the White Council is mentioned several times in the LotR, both in the narrative itself (by both Gandalf and Galadriel) and in the appendices. -- Necrothesp (talk) 15:28, 26 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete. Fails NFICTION/GNG. Wikipedia is not a Tolkien encyclopedia. Kacper IV (talk) 12:36, 26 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete for now. I saw this because I have a strong suspicion that Lord of the Rings (TV Series) will include the first White Council lead by Gilgalad. Of course, I could be totally off on what will happen in the LoTR TV series, but since it is not created yet, and even less has affected secondary literature, that is all idle speculation that can not be used to keep this article at present.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:14, 26 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Here Lord of the Rings (TV series) is the correct link. I have no idea why my link I put in didn't work.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:15, 26 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Capitalization of S in series. Probably not worth creating a redirect. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 03:47, 27 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Considering right now it is just a redirect, I fully agree. Since they have apparently not began production, there is no reason to create a seperate article. Yes, it is alleged this will be the biggest budget TV show ever, but at present my theory it will deal with the forging of the rings of power is not supported by anything but teaser tweets of maps and poems, which give us very little clear idea of what is occuring.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:10, 27 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Comment The article takes an in-universe view of this thing, writting of it as if it is a real thing. This is problematic since Tolkien never wrote minutes of its meetings. To keep this article we need more transparancy on the sourcing, and to distinguish what is said in The Hobbitt, LoTR, what is said in the appendices, and what is said somewhere else. That transparancy, or even the admission that in the Hobbit this was a plot contrivance with little meaning to what was actually going on, is lacking in the article. These articles have huge lacking in real world acceptance, including accepting the fact that with a mention in the first version of "policeman", the world that the Hobbit was set in was not orginally the world of Lithien and the Hobbit changed. We need real-world coverage, not just fictional world coverage. This is probably an even bigger need in our comic book articles on everyone from Superman to Batman, but it is also needed here.John Pack Lambert (talk) 16:21, 26 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Gandalf. Goustien (talk) 07:36, 28 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Gandalf as per Goustien. It's covered in a more encyclopedic tone there anyway. But if it redirected, The Lord of the Rings: The White Council should be added to the "See also" section.  Onel 5969  TT me 19:38, 30 November 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete or redirect - The topic fails GNG. TTN (talk) 14:58, 1 December 2019 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.