Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Winds of Change


 * Nominate Winds of Change (see also Paul Willmore Sr.).
 * The two articles mentioned are near orphans: they are linked by each other, but otherwise only by one list in one case and two lists in the other. Willmore appears unknown on Google, except in the article his page links to, and that page has two different spellings of his surname.
 * Both articles use the word "Christian" in the ambiguous way, frequent among Christian fundamentalists/evangelicals, that
 * could imply that doctrines, thought by denominations like Episcopalians, Catholics, Anabaptists, and Quakers to be crucial differences among denominations, are overrated trivialities, but
 * for many of them seem to express that if you don't claim to be "born again" you aren't a real Christian.
 * Cleaning up that PoV is not the point: it is mentioned here because it is so consistent with the possibility that the creator of these two articles determined notability solely by being impressed in a personal contact with the band and person.
 * Non-fame is also suggested by the designation on the linked Web page (based in the UK, where Willmore met his wife) of the band as "grassroots", often a euphemism for "non-famous".
 * Though the two articles require separate votes, my nomination reasons are identical, and copied on both discussion pages.
 * --Jerzy(t) 18:21, 2004 Jun 30 (UTC)


 * Keep. Band big among Christian listeners in England. Antonio John (is a) Major Pain Martin''
 * If it was then they would have some web presence. A web site that takes submissions doesn't count. And the Christian music market in the UK is pretty small as far as I know. We are a pretty secular country. Secretlondon 22:03, 30 Jun 2004 (UTC)
 * Allmusic hasn't heard of them or Ghost Ryders. Delete unless notability verified by people other than AntonioMartin. Mr. Martin is excluded because he wrote the page. -- Cyrius|&#9998; 21:00, 30 Jun 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete: no evidence of notability. Wile E. Heresiarch 03:28, 1 Jul 2004 (UTC)
 * A search for '"Winds of Change" band music christian' on google.co.uk gets precisely 2 working verifiable hits and maybe 3 others that used to be links but are now dead - and the working links are on a dedicated christian music site, hardly indicitive of notability outside the field. I'm in the UK, and I've never heard of them, and Christian music is not an influencial force in the artistic community, nor is this group notable for anything else. I suspect Vanity or agenda pushing. Delete SkArcher 16:58, 1 Jul 2004 (UTC)


 * Delete: I agree that this is probably promotion. I agree that there is no proof of the band's notability.  However, the fact that it's from a music genre that isn't mainstream isn't relevant for notability, if club DJ's, rave organizers (Mutoid Waste Company), and the bootleg folks aren't critiqued the same way.  The same would be true of OS's.  To me, these are all notable scenes that aren't mainstream.  I.e. it's a significant scene, though not mainstream, so it's about the same as any other notable scene. Not my thing, but it only needs a lot of participants, and the Christian music scene has a lot of participants. Geogre 16:30, 4 Jul 2004 (UTC)


 * Keep Factually accurate, inoffensive and non-cluttering. --[[User:OldakQuill|Oldak Quill]] 16:54, 5 Jul 2004 (UTC)