Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Yopu

 This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record. The result of the debate was that it is a gigantic poo joke. I like poo jokes, but they shouldn't be on Wikipedia, so this has been deleted rather earlier than usual. - Ta bu shi da yu 16:25, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Yopu

 * Hoax. Neutralitytalk 22:38, Dec 31, 2004 (UTC)
 * Not a hoax. Not all history has been recorded on the internet and can be found in google. (This line was originally put here to replace Neutrality's by User:Tteexx)
 * delete That's indeed what I thought - a lot of crap in that article, but I wikified it anyway. Seemed meaningless, but I wasn't sure, couldn't find anything else but this on the net so I guess it's a hoax too (and the pic doesn't look like someone living in 1250-something). Hoax? probably. --Anthony Liekens 22:41, 31 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete, hoax. Rje 22:47, 31 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep, I'm an historian studying quirky and unusual stories out of Tibet. Though this sounds ridiculous, it is a humours legend told by local villagers.  Part of the story is lost in translation leading it to sound more fantastic than originally intended.User:Tteexx  talk
 * Delete, possibly move to BJAODN.-gadfium 23:14, 31 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Delete: This is a big Poo movement. DCEdwards1966 23:26, Dec 31, 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep, I laughed, but then I thought (deeply) what if it's true man, what if it's all true, I've never been to Tibet, but what if it's all true, THAT is all I'm saying, what if it's all true.
 * That vote by IP 24.243.117.61 Andrewa 03:09, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete unless an citation that can be independently verified is provided. Average Earthman 23:36, 31 Dec 2004 (UTC)
 * Keep, Interesting information. I previewed an abstract of the cited paper.  - Dr. Li.
 * That vote by IP 207.189.111.32. Andrewa 03:31, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep, I have seen this statue in Tibet and heard this story. Don't judge this legend without the facts folks. -- Ed Jones - Tok, Alaska.
 * You've already voted, user:Tteexx. Andrewa 03:22, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * You're right Andrewa, I did vote (once). However, Ed Jones was from ip: 137.229.34.152 ... which from the looks of it, is in Alaska.
 * Quite right. Please sign your posts, and you'll save us all this trouble. Andrewa 03:45, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * keep, This is a "legend" guys, so no one can prove it factual. Does wikipedia really want to censor all legends? (Fermin Salinas, DDS., Corpus Christi, Texas)
 * That vote by IP 165.95.11.15. Andrewa 03:35, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, probable hoax. Note, all the keep votes are either by the article's author, or are unsigned. Wyss 01:48, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, unless main contributor to article provides verifiable evidence of the legend's existence and someone independent verifies it. I would suggest a print reference since that is the traditional Wikipedia standard for verifiability&mdash;such as a reference to a major journal, one that's carried by university libraries or major public libraries, or a book with an ISBN number. So far all that has given is a URL that yields a "404 not found." There seems to be no Google cache for the page, or does archive.org's "wayback machine" contain it. Dpbsmith (talk) 01:58, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * P. S. I've submitted a query to kuixing@panopticonasia.com and timothyfox@panopticonasia.com, editor and publisher of the cited journal, explaining the situation and asking whether such an article actually appeared; see Talk:Yopu for details. I'll summarize their reply here if I get one. Dpbsmith (talk) 01:58, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Citation:


 * Lewinski and Manes. "Legends of Rural Tibet." The Journal of Asian/Diasporic and Aboriginal Literature. http://www.kuixing.panopticonasia.com/fall04/yopu.html. Fall 2004.
 * The link to our article has been taken down, as the Journal seems to be undergoing some updates. You can however visit http://www.kuixing.panopticonasia.com to see that the journal does in fact exist.
 * A personal interview that we conducted has now been placed on the main page.


 * KEEP - I feel this article deserves to be read. This is a story for the generations and nothing but good can come from the knowledge that it imparts. -- Josh
 * That vote by IP 24.155.106.238. Andrewa 03:39, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Comment Question for User:Tteexx. The image used in the illustration appears to have had the Adobe Photoshop "crystallize" effect applied to it. Can you tell us why this was done instead of submitting the original, unfiltered image? You identify yourself as "the creator of the image." Does that mean it is an original artwork by you? If not, what is the source of the image? Dpbsmith (talk) 03:53, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * I am the creator of the image. Yopu lived in the 13th century so no photographs exist of him.  I took a collage of pictures taken from the region and created a digital representation of what Yopu may have looked like. TTeexx
 * From the website: "The first of the twice-yearly issues of Kui Xing will be available, conditions permitting, in Spring 2005." Shimeru 03:44, Jan 1, 2005 (UTC)
 * Note: I had some trouble finding this, so I'll mention there it is. Go to http://www.kuixing.panopticonasia.com Click "home," then "call for papers," then scroll down to "Submitting a paper," section (C), Calendar. However, and confusingly, clicking on "current issue" yields "Our apologies. The first online edition of Kui Xing is planned for Spring 2004." Dpbsmith (talk) 04:13, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Unverifiable, probable hoax, possible Internet phenomenon. All keep votes are from the author or IPs with no previous edits. I've slapped a disputed tag on it, see the talk page. My guess is we'll see more and more of these, but probably the existing VfD and accuracy dispute procedures will handle them for the moment. Andrewa 03:58, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Apparent hoax. Wile E. Heresiarch 08:36, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete Complete hoax. Holodoctor1 11:43, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep, we can mark it disputed if we like, but the website seems like huge lengths to go to just to support a hoax article in Wikipedia. If the journal doesn't show up sometime over the coming months we can revisit this. (changing vote)--Tony Sidaway|Talk 17:32, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Huh? Nothing is supposed to be in Wikipedia unless it is verifiable. So far, this article is not verifiable. Have you verified it? Can you verify it? Nobody is disputing the existence of the online journal http://www.kuixing.panopticonasia.com. Nobody is suggesting that the website is a fabrication by User:Tteexx. But... that website says nothing about Yopu. Tteexx cites a nonexistent URL that returns a 404 Not Found. For an article that appeared in 2004. In a journal that says it will publish its first article in 2005. I mean, I could write an about the legend of the Miracle-working Hermit of Wachusett, citing http://www.nytimes.com/2004/04/15/religion/02hermit.html as evidence of the legend's reality, and saying "True, the article I cited doesn't exist, but The New York Times exists." Dpbsmith (talk) 19:51, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Actually it says the first one is planned for Spring of 2004. The site is going through some changes and I'm sure the journals will reappear soon.
 * Delete, hoax or not verifiable. --fvw *  19:46, 2005 Jan 1 (UTC)
 * Delete: It isn't verified or verifiable. I'd like us to be up to date as much as the next person, but encyclopedias report the accepted (agreed upon) truth.  This is not a journal, nor a place for exciting breakthroughs or original research.  Until this is verified and verifiable (and, btw, I at least am highly suspicious of the journal that exists only on the web), it's a hoax.  Geogre 20:27, 1 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep - I just heard the personal interview, and it made me weep! -Dune Zhu, Medford, Oregon
 * Posted by 66.169.253.2
 * Comment The journal, http://www.kuixing.panopticonasia.com is associated with a Yahoo Group named KuiXing. The group has seventeen members and 115 archived messages. None of them mention Yopu or Yopumundi or Lewinski or Manes. Dpbsmith (talk) 00:33, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. If it looks like a hoax, and talks like a hoax, and smells like a hoax, then it has to come with sources that are verifiable now. If, in addition, all but one Keep are demonstrably bogus, those sources better be blessed by Yopu himself. And I don't mean the little troll, which I'm mentioning for no particular reason at all. JRM 02:01, 2005 Jan 2 (UTC)
 * Weak Keep, until it is proven beyond doubt that it's a hoax. Megan1967 03:07, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Unverifiable, likely hoax. Jayjg  |  (Talk)  05:48, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Unsure. I'm 80% convinced this is a hoax, but there's that other 20%.  Tteexx, if you have this alleged journal article why not show it to us?  You can email it to me at nought_0000(at)yahoo.com (in Chinese is ok) and I will support you if it appears genuine.  Either way, the onus is on you to prove that the article is for real. --Zero 08:20, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC) I just noticed that the "I laughed" addition above was made by an anon who is obviously identical to User:Tteexx (see the article history).  This is tantamount to an admission that the article is fake, so I'm changing my vote to delete. --Zero 08:45, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Please don't try to deceive us. It isn't worth your time or ours. Everyking 09:15, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete - it's a hoax. Smoddy | Talk 13:28, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, a hoax, the bit about fertilizing rice which is not grown in any part of Tibet is a giveaway Fred Bauder 13:32, Jan 2, 2005 (UTC)
 * Wow. The Pu Rebellion. We wouldn't want them to eat peasant poo. I suggest we delete this patent nonsense. - Ta bu shi da yu 13:46, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)
 * delete. Hoax. (this is a changed vote) --Tony Sidaway|Talk 13:51, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)

This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion or on the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.

Additional comment made subsequent to closure of VfD is available, including promised followup relevant to evaluating the deletion decision, available at here. Dpbsmith (talk) 12:14, 7 Jan 2005 (UTC)