Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Yungun


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.  

The result was keep based on late findings by YV, single purpose accounts also noted. Can&#39;t sleep, clown will eat me 20:07, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Yungun
no reasons for notability provided, hip-hop musician unlikely to pass Music guidelines and apparently "training to be a solicitor". Marcus22 09:37, 18 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Delete and redirect to Yangon as plausible typo. --Nlu (talk) 09:43, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Delete and redirect per Nlu. No explanation how this guy meets WP:MUSIC. Mango juice talk 11:54, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Keep. Well, you've got to. Anyway. --Primetime 10:01, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Comment erm.. could you expand on your reasoning Primetime? (Strange user page you've got there, btw).  Marcus22 10:05, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Indef blocked sockpuppet of banned user. MER-C 10:48, 18 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Keep. I am Primetime, no-one bans me from Wikipedia! Just keep the damned article!! --Primetime 10:06, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Keep. More notable than George W. Bush, more notable than Bill Clinton, notable entity. --Wordywiseman 10:20, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Indef blocked sockpuppet of blocked/banned user. MER-C 10:48, 18 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Keep. This guy is more notable than Dubya ever was. --FlightCopy 10:23, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Indef blocked sockpuppet of banned user. MER-C 10:48, 18 October 2006 (UTC)

Just one vote please, Mr Sockpuppet. Marcus22 10:13, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Keep. Of course he's a notable entity, more so than Lumidee. --Karmafist 10:26, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Indef blocked sockpuppet of banned user. MER-C 10:48, 18 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Keep. Heh-heh. --213.162.236.9 10:32, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Probably another sockpuppet of a banned user. MER-C 10:48, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * That is an open proxy. Jesse Viviano 15:59, 19 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Keep. Notable individual! --FireyFireMan 10:33, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Suspected sockpuppet of a banned user. MER-C 10:48, 18 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Strong keep. Yungun is one of, if not the most famous hip hop artist in Britain, excluding the London grime craze. He regularly tours nationally and internationally. He has numerous releases that are clearly available for purchase on major online stores such as Amazon.com, Play.com etc. He has performed live on numerous national radio stations. He is regularly featured in the national music press and extensively in hip-hop magazines. He has been placed in rotation by many stations including BBC Radio One, Britain's most popular station. A most definite strong keep! And no, I am not a sock puppet. Yeanold Viskersenn 14:44, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Well that's fine and dandy Yeanold! Not sure I agree that he's the most famous in Britain etc.. but if you provide the sources for the BBC etc that would make things much clearer.  Then I could just withdraw nom., tidy up the page and voila!  Marcus22 16:22, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Yungun album and single available on Amazon http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_ss_w_h_/026-5738880-3712437?url=search-alias%3Dpopular&field-keywords=yungun
 * Recent playlist from BBC Radio 1xtra featuring Yungun http://www.bbc.co.uk/1xtra/blakey/20060920.shtml
 * Another playlist from BBC Asian Network http://www.bbc.co.uk/asiannetwork/friction/playlist_archive_06_07_17.shtml Yeanold Viskersenn 17:40, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Comment Well I dont know much about hip-hop but those sources look good enough for me. If no-one has any objections can I withdraw the nomination? Marcus22 18:41, 18 October 2006 (UTC) altered to take into account following
 * Comment I believe you can't withdraw a nom that has objections in it. See the first two delete arguments.  And the "references" are not non-trivial (a playlist doesn't establish anything other than the fact that it's been played on a playlist).  Amazon establishes the album exists, but not much else.  I'd like to see a review or something like that on the album.  ColourBurst 20:01, 18 October 2006 (UTC)


 *  Delete , nothing here hits WP:MUSIC or WP:BLP. You cannot withdraw a nom that has been objected to. References and sources must be in the article, not the AfD discussion. I don't agree that being featured on a minor / niche radio station playlist (BBC or not) or two confers notability, that's a long way from e.g. being a charted artist on a notable label or the subject of multiple non-trival media reports.  Dei zio  talk 22:16, 18 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Good work by YV.  Dei zio  talk 23:27, 19 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Comment BBC Radio One tracklisting from Steve Lamacq's show, featuring Yungun's single "Dancing Shoes" http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio1/stevelamacq/tracklistingarchive.shtml?20040223. Clearly meets WP:MUSIC - "Has been placed in rotation nationally by any major radio network." Yeanold Viskersenn 03:02, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
 * No it doesn't. "Rotation" is very different to being played once. Rotation means you can expect to hear it several times per day across various different shows, for a reasonable length of time, usually because it has reached the charts or is a new release by a recognized artist. Keep trying.  Dei zio  talk 09:06, 19 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Rotation is a unit of measurement for how often a song is played, not a specific frequency of plays. If a song is played only once then it is still "in rotation" (and I can assure you that Yungun's singles have been played far more than once - here's another BBC playlist with his single "Dancing Shoes" http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio1/stevelamacq/tracklistingarchive.shtml?20040209, and here's two more from Zane Lowe's show http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio1/zanelowe/tracklistingarchive.shtml?20040128, http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio1/zanelowe/tracklistingarchive.shtml?20040316, and yet more from Bethan and Huw http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio1/bethanandhuw/tracklistingarchive.shtml?20040422, he has even performed ENTIRE LIVE SETS IN THE STUDIO at Radio One - http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio1/raskwame/tracklistingarchive.shtml?tracklist_20060809). I don't see how you can justify regular airplay (amongst other things) from some of Radio One's most well known DJs as non-notable. Aside from this, Yungun has also presented a feature length show for Radio 1xtra. He has been interviewed by Craig Charles on BBC 6 Music. He has had live concerts broadcast on GCap Media's XFM Station. He has been featured in published works of reputable media, including regular spots in the world's oldest hip-hop magazine, Hip-Hop Connection (http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n58/shinawhite/HHCREV.jpg, http://www.hhcmagazine.com/archive.htm#story4). On top of this he has performed on international festival tours, such as Love Planet, Hip-Hop Kemp and the Bestival Festival. He was even the host of the MTV Europe Awards and the Cannes Film Festival MTV Party. Ask any British rap fan his name and they'll tell you. Clearly notable on numerous points. Yeanold Viskersenn 14:10, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
 * You're clearly a big fan. "Rotation" means a song is played regularly (for the reasons I outlined above), that's both the definition as it pertains to mainstream radio and the spirit of the word as used in the WP guideline. In general, if something is (used) in rotation (e.g. crops, footballers, clothes etc.) they appear on a recurring basis or, as Wiktionary puts it, "a regular variation in a sequence". I also note you've done nothing to improve the article (which you have edited once, on June 26), you might want to invest your time in that rather than this afd discussion where you have clearly voiced your opinion as "keep".  Dei zio  talk 14:37, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
 * As a music scholar I can tell you that in terms of radio airplay, rotation is actually derived from the term "spin", literally meaning the vinyl rotating on the deck. You don't seem to have cited the source of your definition "as it pertains to mainstream radio and the spirit of the word as used in the WP guideline" but anyway this isn't relevant. I've shown than Yungun is indeed notable on multiple counts, and whether I'm a fan or not is irrelevant. Nor do I have to be an active contributor to the article itself in order to discuss its deletion. Yeanold Viskersenn 15:29, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Indeed you don't, and we'll have to agree to disagree on the meaning of rotation. However, you should still edit the article rather than the AfD discussion to show it satisfies WP:MUSIC.  Dei zio  talk 15:36, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I have now :) Yeanold Viskersenn 17:34, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Looks better with the new assertions but still needs external references per Verifiability and WP:MUSIC. I'm not sure if playlists count as WP:RS but I'm sure you can find something appropriate if he's the superstar you tell us he is.  Dei zio  talk 17:46, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
 * I've added numerous citations now. I don't think you can beat official playlists with regards to citing radio airplay apart from hearing the show itself. And for the record, I never claimed he was a superstar, but he certainly is one of UK hip-hop's most prominent figureheads. I don't know why you're taking this condescending attitude towards me when all I'm doing is trying to defend the deletion of an article that I know shouldn't be deleted. I find comments like "you're clearly a big fan", "you've done nothing to improve the article", "keep trying" and "if he's the superstar you tell us he is" to be unnecessary and somewhat impolite. Perhaps that's just me though. Yeanold Viskersenn 23:18, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
 * In which case I apologize... all the socks above put me on defensive mode in debates like this. The point behind my involvement here has been to get the article up to scratch per the relevant content policies and guidelines. Wd w/ the refs.  Dei zio  talk 23:27, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
 * That's OK then - I hope my contributions have helped. Yeanold Viskersenn 23:33, 19 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Keep per above. --badlydrawnjeff talk 14:51, 19 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Keep, because it satisfies elements of WP:MUSIC. It would be nice to have another reference on him, however (there's one article on him; the other references are just playlists and mentions of appearances.  However, WP:V does not seem to regard triviality of references (Notability guidelines do), so this is okay.) ColourBurst 01:33, 20 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Keep per above. Also he has been interviewed at ukhh.com (basically the most popular uk hiphop website) several times. DeanSas 02:14, 20 October 2006 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.